More Republicans for states' rights
 

I think this is unfair. Clearly, sometimes it's about lowering the bar. Or rationalizing the bar. But not always. I know that in one area in which I work (security breach notification laws) the impacted industries really do just want uniformity above all else, although certainly wouldn't mind if they could pare back some of the loopier state laws (i.e., Illinois, which is extremely overzealous in its notification - you know you've overshot your mark when businesses are holding out California as a better model of balancing interests).

More Republicans for states' rights
 

Since we're talking about food-safety regulation, I feel fairly comfortable saying that the issue is the underlying requirements, not the labeling.

Say Good Bye to Lawtalkers
 

2. Why not just have in the ToS an agreement not to use the service in New Jersey?

Anyway, I suspect this is unconstitutional on its face.

More Republicans for states' rights
 

That's fine, but then the debate should be about the bar. You've raised a separate question, which I've challenged. I still have yet to see a principled reason from you or someone else as to why the federal government should be able to set minimum standards but not set maximum standards. Or, put differently, why states can't opt out of any federal standards either to make them more or less rigorous because of local conditions adn assessments of the costs.

More Republicans for states' rights
 

There's a principle firmly embodied in our constitutional system of federalism.

Say Good Bye to Lawtalkers
 

I'd be more concerned if I were a business with an actual presence in NJ. I think what a company in NJ would have to do to avoid liability is pack up all its servers, fire or transfer all it's NJ employees, and open up somewhere else.

NJ's message is simple: get out. We don't want your jobs or your taxes.

As an added bonus, moving out of NJ probably lowers labor and real estate costs significantly.

Say Good Bye to Lawtalkers
 

Think of what a disaster this law would create. It'll never fly in this present format.

More Republicans for states' rights
 

I thought the original motivation was a california reg. that required a warning food was potentially dangerous because of some process used to prepare it. It wasn't to ban food made by the process, was it?

Say Good Bye to Lawtalkers
 

The entire New Jersey State Legislature sucks dick. Except for the females. They suck dog dick. There, motherfuckers. Come and get me.

Say Good Bye to Lawtalkers
 

I think it's called the "New Jersey is Too Fucking Stoopid to Understand the Dormant Commerce Clause Act."

Say Good Bye to Lawtalkers
 

Aren't the states currently prohibited from regulating the internet?

Say Good Bye to Lawtalkers
 

Virginia has a crimnal statute banning spam. it is under challenge under the commerce clause. To my knowledge, there is no federal statute banning state regulation of its use expressly ,however (which is why they're relying on the constitutional argument).

Not sure why a state can't adopt such a law (absent federal preemption, though). The NY Times is subject to libel laws in 50 states, which differ. So long as they all are consistent with teh first amendment, so be it.

Say Good Bye to Lawtalkers
 

I think it will be scaled back to only deal with companies in NJ or incorporated in NJ.

Say Good Bye to Lawtalkers
 

I believe there is a federal ban on state internet sales taxes. Not sure if it's a specific preemptive statute or falls under a more general preemptive statute.

Say Good Bye to Lawtalkers
 

Were they to sue you for defamation, they'd be open to liability under their own Frivolous Litigation Statute.

Say Good Bye to Lawtalkers
 

Texas has a "no spyware" law that has been applied to prosecute Sony/BMG for their anti-piracy software. I presume it is as applicable to downloaded software as it is to software on CDs.

Say Good Bye to Lawtalkers
 

They're prohibited from taxing it. I don't think there's a blanket prohibition on regulation, but I'm not positive.

Wow
 

I don't know if I've ever killed a board before.

Wow
 

You've just never noticed. Come back in a week and I'm sure there'll be some things you can respond to.

There is a three part report on NPR about a ruling in a silicosis case here in Texas (though the plaintiffs are all in Mississippi) that ya'll probably would find interesting.

First part (Audio was transcribed onto this page, but the physician they interview sounds so smarmy it's probably worth it to hear the audio.)

Second part (Audio only)

Third part (Again, transcribed. More of a background on silicosis and its sudden attractiveness to plaintiffs lawyers. Most interesting part from this one, I thought was this gem: )

Gee. For $39 billion, you might be able to find a cure for asbestosis.

Are you a liberal?
 

Do you believe the following?
1. Standards for admissions to universities, fire departments, etc. should be lowered for people of color.
2. Bilingual education for children of immigrants, rather than immersion in English, is good for them and for America.
3. School districts should not be able to fire incompetent teachers or principles
4. Students should not be tested because it hurts their self esteem
5. Students should not be held back because it hurts their self esteem
6. People who are rich generally have taken their wealth from somebody else rather than created it.
7. Child molesters and murderers, even if they are guilty, should be let free if their rights have been violated.
8. Peace with tyranny is preferable to war without tyranny.
9. Murderers should never be put to death.
10. During the Cold War, America should have adopted a nuclear arms freeze.
11. Colleges should not allow ROTC programs.
12. It was wrong to wage war against Saddam Hussein in the Gulf War.
13. Iraq was better off being ruled by Saddam Hussein rather than the Coalition forces.
14. Poor parents should not be allowed to have vouchers to send their children to private schools.
15. It is good that trial lawyers and teachers unions are the two biggest contributors to the Democratic Party.
16. The present high tax rates are good.
17. Speech codes on college campuses are good and promote American values.
18. The United Nations is a moral force for good in the world, and therefore America should be subservient to it and such international institutions as as the world court.
19. Other countries (including France, Russia and China) should have a say whether the US can act in furtherance of its National Security.
20. It is good that colleges have dropped hundreds of men's sports teams in order to meet gender-based quotas.
21. Racial profiling for terrorists is wrong -- a white American grandmother should as likely be searched as a Saudi young male.
22. Racism and poverty -- not a lack of fathers and a crisis of values -- are the primary causes of violent crime in the inner city.
23. No culture is morally superior to any other.

Are you a liberal?
 

Why are these (or some of these) liberal verses conservative?

Also, you dare show your face around here the day after getting your ass handed to you by Tom Delay?

Are you a conservative:
1. Standards for admissions to universities, fire departments, etc. should be based only upon scores on admission tests, without regard to any other factors.
2. All people should be assimilated into a single American culture.
3. School districts should direct teachers or principles [sic] with an iron fist, allowing no discretion in the academic program
4. Students should be tested repeatedly, and all teaching should be oriented at passing the tests rather than actual life skills
5. Only standardized tests should be used to determine the value of a person; individuals who work with students every day should have absolutely no say in whether they should be moved up.
6. People who are poor deserve to be poor because they are lazy or stupid, or both.
7. Torture and coercion are acceptable techniques to lead to criminal convictions, even if they lead to false convictions; the important thing is that someone go to jail.
8. Tyranny is okay as long as business interests not interfered with (or no one threatens your Daddy).
9. Murderers should always be put to death.
10. During the Cold War, it was a good thing that the Soviet Union built thousands of ICBMs and then left them in the hands of breakaway republics such that the world has no idea where a significant amount of weapons grade nuclear material is.
11. Colleges (even those founded by religions) should be forced to allow ROTC programs.
12. It was right to leave Saddam Hussein in place after the Gulf War.
13. Providing a stable government is less important than removing a dictator.
14. Poor children whose parents can't afford private schools even with vouchers should be happy to go to schools whose resources have been slashed to provide for vouchers for middle class kids.
15. It is good that big energy and corporate America are the two biggest contributors to the Republican Party.
16. The present tax rates, while lower than almost any first world nation, should be slashed further, even at the cost of providing basic emergency services.
17. Ethics codes on college campuses are good and promote American values.
18. War is a better way of solving disputes between countries than agreed upon arbitration.
19. Other countries should never have differing opinions about whether the United States is doing the right thing, and if they do, we should invade them.
20. It is bad that colleges have created hundreds of women's sports teams.
21. Racial profiling for terrorists is the only mechanism that should be used to find terrorists. Behaviorial clues are irrelevant to determining actual treats compared to the color of one's skin or last name.
22. Being morally corrupt and ignorant and stupid -- not a complex interaction of a multitude of social forces -- are the primary causes of violent crime in the inner city.
23. WASP culture is morally superior to any other.

Are you a liberal?
 

Yes that sucked. Taking on an incumbant is always a tough gig. I raised a lot of money, but unfortunately that wasn't good enough.

On the Liberal v. Conservative I think the liberal point of view is fairly painted. You would have to be an arch liberal to agree with all of them, but that is why it is a good test. However on one or two I take the liberal point of view.

Are you a liberal?
 

Why so cynical? Let's all simply be glad that Spanky is still alive and that the Angry GOP Hammer of Retribution hasn't made it past the deer brigades.

Are you a liberal?
 

No, it's not fairly painted. Do you consider my charaterization of the conservative viepoint fair?

I'm just giving you shit about Delay; it really was almost a lost cause, but a noble one.

Do you believe the following?
1. Standards for admissions to universities, fire departments, etc. should be lowered for people of color.

THAT IS FAIR. THAT IS EXACTLY WHAT AFFIRMATIVE ACTION IS.

2. Bilingual education for children of immigrants, rather than immersion in English, is good for them and for America.

THAT IS FAIR.
3. School districts should not be able to fire incompetent teachers or principles.

MAYBE TOO EXTREME. BUT WE JUST HAD A PROPOSITION ABOUT THIS IN CALIFORNIA. MAYBE IT SHOULD SAY THAT IT SHOULD BE VERY DIFFICULT FOR SCHOOL DISTRICTS TO FIRE INCOMPETENT TEACHERS OR PRINCPLES.

4. Students should not be tested because it hurts their self esteem

I HAVE MET MANY MEMBERS OF THE TEACHERS UNION WHO FEEL THIS WAY.
5. Students should not be held back because it hurts their self esteem

THIS IS THE EXACT POLICY IN A LOCAL SCHOOL DISTRICT HERE.
6. People who are rich generally have taken their wealth from somebody else rather than created it.

THAT IS FAIR. I KNOW MANY PEOPLE WHO BELIEVE THIS.

7. Child molesters and murderers, even if they are guilty, should be let free if their rights have been violated.

THAT IS PERFECTLY ACCURATE. IF YOU SUPPORT WITH EXCLUSIONARY RULE YOU AGREE WITH THAT STATEMENT.
8. Peace with tyranny is preferable to war without tyranny.

ISN'T THIS WHAT THE PEACE MOVEMENT IS ALL ABOUT?

9. Murderers should never be put to death.

ANY ONE WHO IS AGAINST THE DEATH PENALTY AGREES WITH THAT STATEMENT
10. During the Cold War, America should have adopted a nuclear arms freeze.

WHAT IS UNFAIR ABOUT THIS?
11. Colleges should not allow ROTC programs.

MANY PEOPLE BELIEVE THIS.
12. It was wrong to wage war against Saddam Hussein in the Gulf War.

WHAT IS UNFAIR ABOUT THIS?
13. Iraq was better off being ruled by Saddam Hussein rather than the Coalition forces.

ISN'T THIS WHAT EVERYONE AGAINST THE WAR IS SAYING?

14. Poor parents should not be allowed to have vouchers to send their children to private schools.

THIS IS FAIR. I MIGHT EVEN AGREE WITH IT.
15. It is good that trial lawyers and teachers unions are the two biggest contributors to the Democratic Party.

WHAT IS WRONG WITH THIS? MANY DEMOCRATS ARE PROUD TO HAVE THE SUPPORT OT TEACHER UNIONS AND TRIAL LAWYERS.
16. The present high tax rates are good.

MAYBE THE WORD HIGH IS INAPPROPRIATE BUT MANY LIBERALS THINK THE TAX RATES DO NOT NEED TO BE CUT. SOME WOULD EVEN ARGUE FOR HIGHER TAXES.
17. Speech codes on college campuses are good and promote American values.

MANY LIBERALS AGREE WITH THIS DO THEY NOT?

18. The United Nations is a moral force for good in the world, and therefore America should be subservient to it and such international institutions as as the world court.

I BELIEVE THE UN ON BALANCE IS A MORAL FORCE FOR GOOD IN THE WORLD. NOT IN ALL CASES BUT I BELIVE THAT SOMETIMES AMERICA SHOULD BE SUBWERVIENT TO UN INSTITUTIONS SUCH AS THE WTO, PATENT CONVENTIONS ETC.

19. Other countries (including France, Russia and China) should have a say whether the US can act in furtherance of its National Security.

MANY LIBERALS DONT THINK THE US CAN GO TO WAR WITHOUT THE PERMISSION OF THE UN. SINCE EVERY ONE OF THE COUNTRYS HAS A VETO ON THE SECURITY COUNCIL THIS IS FAIR.

20. It is good that colleges have dropped hundreds of men's sports teams in order to meet gender-based quotas.
THIS IS FAIR. WHEN THE CHOICE BECAME GENDER EQUAL THE CHOICE WAS MADE TO DROP MENS SPORTS TEAMS TO INCLUDE MORE FEMALE TEAMS. OFTEN THAT WAS THE RIGHT THING TO DO.

21. Racial profiling for terrorists is wrong -- a white American grandmother should as likely be searched as a Saudi young male.
IF YOU ARE AGAINST RACIAL PROFILING YOU AGREE WITH THIS STATEMENT.

22. Racism and poverty -- not a lack of fathers and a crisis of values -- are the primary causes of violent crime in the inner city.
MANY LIBERALS AGREE WITH THIS. I AM NOT SURE I TOTALLY DISAGREE.

23. No culture is morally superior to any other. MANY LIBERALS BELIEVE THIS. I BELIEVE THIS.

Are you a liberal?
 

ALTHOUGH THEY WOULDN'T ADMIT IT, I KNOW MANY CONSERVATIVES WHO BELIEVE THIS. I THINK IT WOULD INCLUDE MORE CONSERVATIVES IF YOU MADE IT "AMERICAN CULTURE" BECAUSE OF ALL THE CONSERVATIVE CATHOLICS.

Originally posted by Spanky
Do you believe the following?
1. Standards for admissions to universities, fire departments, etc. should be lowered for people of color.

THAT IS FAIR. THAT IS EXACTLY WHAT AFFIRMATIVE ACTION IS.

No, it isn't. That's one form of affirmative action.

2. Bilingual education for children of immigrants, rather than immersion in English, is good for them and for America.

THAT IS FAIR.

No, it isn't. It's not a choice between one and the other. Nor is the right answer the same in all cases. (Although I happen to believe in immersion as an educational technique, actually).


3. School districts should not be able to fire incompetent teachers or principles.

MAYBE TOO EXTREME. BUT WE JUST HAD A PROPOSITION ABOUT THIS IN CALIFORNIA. MAYBE IT SHOULD SAY THAT IT SHOULD BE VERY DIFFICULT FOR SCHOOL DISTRICTS TO FIRE INCOMPETENT TEACHERS OR PRINCPLES.

This question is unfair because it assumes the outcome: of course school districts should be able to fire incompetent teachers. But how do you determine incompetence? Should it be the whim of the superintendant? Should there be some procedure?

4. Students should not be tested because it hurts their self esteem

I HAVE MET MANY MEMBERS OF THE TEACHERS UNION WHO FEEL THIS WAY.

I've never met a teacher who actually felt this way. I think this is bullshit. I think there are many, many teachers who resent having to teach to tests, and who believe that testing methods do not necessarily reflect a student's actual abilities.

5. Students should not be held back because it hurts their self esteem

THIS IS THE EXACT POLICY IN A LOCAL SCHOOL DISTRICT HERE.

Interestingly, I associate this as a conservative policy, coming from Texas where this reform (forbidding social promotion) was imposed by Democrats in the 1980s to the loud howling of conservatives. Let's just agree it's a bad idea, without saying it's "liberal."

6. People who are rich generally have taken their wealth from somebody else rather than created it.

THAT IS FAIR. I KNOW MANY PEOPLE WHO BELIEVE THIS.

But do most liberals believe it? Also, who is to say it's not true?

7. Child molesters and murderers, even if they are guilty, should be let free if their rights have been violated.

THAT IS PERFECTLY ACCURATE. IF YOU SUPPORT WITH EXCLUSIONARY RULE YOU AGREE WITH THAT STATEMENT.

And if we don't have some rule, we have no constitutional guarantees. I think most liberals would agree the system needs improvement.

8. Peace with tyranny is preferable to war without tyranny.

ISN'T THIS WHAT THE PEACE MOVEMENT IS ALL ABOUT?

Is that liberal? I don't think FDR, JFK, LBJ or even Bill Clinton hesitated to use force against tyranny. And what about GHWB?

9. Murderers should never be put to death.

ANY ONE WHO IS AGAINST THE DEATH PENALTY AGREES WITH THAT STATEMENT

Agreed. Why single out murderers, though, except for the fact that is the only category of people we put to death? Most people against the death penalty believe that we, as a society, should not be in the death business. A few of us believe that death is too good for some people.

10. During the Cold War, America should have adopted a nuclear arms freeze.

WHAT IS UNFAIR ABOUT THIS?

It's simplistic.

11. Colleges should not allow ROTC programs.

MANY PEOPLE BELIEVE THIS.

Many more people believe colleges should be allowed a choice. I don't see the distinction between forbidding ROTC in colleges and requiring it.

12. It was wrong to wage war against Saddam Hussein in the Gulf War.

WHAT IS UNFAIR ABOUT THIS?

Why just the Gulf War? Why not Gulf War II? And war vs not-war isn't exactly the issue for many Democrats, as much as timing, preparedness, and setting expectations.

13. Iraq was better off being ruled by Saddam Hussein rather than the Coalition forces.

ISN'T THIS WHAT EVERYONE AGAINST THE WAR IS SAYING?

Not everyone. Some of us are saying there were higher priorities. Some of us are saying we should have been better prepared to actually administer Iraq once we took over. And I'm not sure it's an obvious conclusion that for the average man on the street in Iraq, he's better off.

14. Poor parents should not be allowed to have vouchers to send their children to private schools.

THIS IS FAIR. I MIGHT EVEN AGREE WITH IT.

People who resist vouchers aren't against private schools; they are for public schools. This question is very biased towards a conservative way of thinking, phrasing it about choice rather than about a government handout to some at the expense of another program.


15. It is good that trial lawyers and teachers unions are the two biggest contributors to the Democratic Party.

WHAT IS WRONG WITH THIS? MANY DEMOCRATS ARE PROUD TO HAVE THE SUPPORT OT TEACHER UNIONS AND TRIAL LAWYERS.

This doesn't really kill me. But see the opposite. And I have a hard time getting worked up about teachers unions. It's not like states that have ineffective unions (e.g., Texas) have such great schools.

16. The present high tax rates are good.

MAYBE THE WORD HIGH IS INAPPROPRIATE BUT MANY LIBERALS THINK THE TAX RATES DO NOT NEED TO BE CUT. SOME WOULD EVEN ARGUE FOR HIGHER TAXES.

I don't think tax rates need to be cut, at least so long as we're engaged in a war overseas and continue handing out corporate subsidies like candy.

17. Speech codes on college campuses are good and promote American values.

MANY LIBERALS AGREE WITH THIS DO THEY NOT?

Many conservatives do as well. Many "speech codes" that conservatives object to are not recent inventions, but were instead created by well meaning administrators decades ago. What's so wrong with codes that essentially come down to "Don't be a dick?"

18. The United Nations is a moral force for good in the world, and therefore America should be subservient to it and such international institutions as as the world court.

I BELIEVE THE UN ON BALANCE IS A MORAL FORCE FOR GOOD IN THE WORLD. NOT IN ALL CASES BUT I BELIVE THAT SOMETIMES AMERICA SHOULD BE SUBWERVIENT TO UN INSTITUTIONS SUCH AS THE WTO, PATENT CONVENTIONS ETC.

Subservient is a loaded word. And it ignores the alternatives. UN isn't about subservience. It's about avoiding cataclysmic world wars.

19. Other countries (including France, Russia and China) should have a say whether the US can act in furtherance of its National Security.

MANY LIBERALS DONT THINK THE US CAN GO TO WAR WITHOUT THE PERMISSION OF THE UN. SINCE EVERY ONE OF THE COUNTRYS HAS A VETO ON THE SECURITY COUNCIL THIS IS FAIR.

There's a distinction here that's being lost, and hence why it's unfair. The distinction is "can" vs. "should." Yes, many liberals think that the US should reach concensus with their traditional allies before invading other countries.

20. It is good that colleges have dropped hundreds of men's sports teams in order to meet gender-based quotas.
THIS IS FAIR. WHEN THE CHOICE BECAME GENDER EQUAL THE CHOICE WAS MADE TO DROP MENS SPORTS TEAMS TO INCLUDE MORE FEMALE TEAMS. OFTEN THAT WAS THE RIGHT THING TO DO.

It's not fair, because it ignores the addition of women's sports teams and assumes that gender equality has been reached only by killing men's teams. Sometimes it's both. But Title 9 isn't the problem so much as football is the problem: the teams are so big they throw the rest of the balance off.

21. Racial profiling for terrorists is wrong -- a white American grandmother should as likely be searched as a Saudi young male.
IF YOU ARE AGAINST RACIAL PROFILING YOU AGREE WITH THIS STATEMENT.

Why should race be the only standard used? In fact, there would seem to be a lot of factors that are more relevant. Time of flight, Method of payment, luggage, etc.

22. Racism and poverty -- not a lack of fathers and a crisis of values -- are the primary causes of violent crime in the inner city.
MANY LIBERALS AGREE WITH THIS. I AM NOT SURE I TOTALLY DISAGREE.

Once again, it's unfair to make this an either/or proposition.

23. No culture is morally superior to any other. MANY LIBERALS BELIEVE THIS. I BELIEVE THIS.

Agreed. This is the most facially neutral of the questions.

[/QUOTE]

Are you a liberal?
 

Are you a conservative:
1. Standards for admissions to universities, fire departments, etc. should be based only upon scores on admission tests, without regard to any other factors.

MOST CONSERVATIVES WOULD AGREE WITH THIS AS LONG AS THE TESTS TEST ABILITY FOR THE JOB.

And how are you going to assure that?

2. All people should be assimilated into a single American culture.

MANY CONSERVATIVES BELIEVE THIS .

But what "American" culture.

3. School districts should direct teachers or principles [sic] with an iron fist, allowing no discretion in the academic program

I DON'T THINK THAT IS FAIR AND MOST CONSERVATIVE BELIEVE IN LOCAL CONTROL.

This is completely inconsistent with No Child Left Behind.

4. Students should be tested repeatedly, and all teaching should be oriented at passing the tests rather than actual life skills

MOST CONSERVATIVES BELIEVE STUDENTS SHOULD BE TESTED REPEATEDLY. BUT THEY BELIEVE THE TEST SHOULD BE GEARED SO THAT PREPARING FOR THE TEST FORCES THE STUDENT TO LEARN THE SUBJECT. I THINK, AND MOST CONSERVATIVES AGREE THAT READING AND WRITING AND MATH ARE ACTUAL LIFE SKILLS.

And yet, that's not how it works.

5. Only standardized tests should be used to determine the value of a person; individuals who work with students every day should have absolutely no say in whether they should be moved up.

NO CONSERVATIVE AGREES WITH THE FIRST LINE. I THINK THE SECOND LINE IS MOSTLY FAIR. TESTS SHOULD DETERMINE IF A STUDENT SHOULD MOVE UP.

How do you reconcile this answer with number one, above. Sure, I'm using loaded words, but ability = value.

6. People who are poor deserve to be poor because they are lazy or stupid, or both.

SOME ARCH CONSERVATIVES ME BELIEVE THIS. HOWEVER, I DON'T THINK THE OVERWHELMING MAJORITY BELIEVE THIS.

I think this is about as fair as some of the statements in your list.

7. Torture and coercion are acceptable techniques to lead to criminal convictions, even if they lead to false convictions; the important thing is that someone go to jail.

I DON'T KNOW ANYONE WHO AGREES WITH THIS.

Sure they do. That's the consequence of not enforcing our constitutional limitations on criminal prosecutions.

8. Tyranny is okay as long as business interests not interfered with (or no one threatens your Daddy).

I DON'T KNOW ANYONE AGREES WITH THIS.

Sure they do. If tyranny is so bad, how come we're not invading all the dictatorships in the world. Why did George Sr leave Saddam in power?

9. Murderers should always be put to death.

DEPENDS ON YOUR DEFINITION OF MURDER. BUT I KNOW SOME CONSERVATIVES WHO AGREE WITH THIS.

Agreed.

10. During the Cold War, it was a good thing that the Soviet Union built thousands of ICBMs and then left them in the hands of breakaway republics such that the world has no idea where a significant amount of weapons grade nuclear material is.

NO ONE I KNOW AGREES WITH THIS. IF YOU ARE SAYING THIS HAPPENED BECAUSE THERE WAS NO NUCLEAR FREEZE YOU ARE FLAT WRONG.

It made it worse.

11. Colleges (even those founded by religions) should be forced to allow ROTC programs.

ONLY IF THEY GET PUBLIC FUNDS. BUT IF YOU ADD COLLEGES RECEIVEING PUBLIC FUNDS MOST CONSERVATIVE AGREE.

Well, I can't be outrageous on all of them.

12. It was right to leave Saddam Hussein in place after the Gulf War.
THAT IS FAIR. I AGREE WITH THIS ALTHOUGH I DON'T KNOW IF THAT IS THE CONSERVATIVE POSITION.
13. Providing a stable government is less important than removing a dictator.

THAT IS FAIR.
14. Poor children whose parents can't afford private schools even with vouchers should be happy to go to schools whose resources have been slashed to provide for vouchers for middle class kids.

THAT IS NOT FAIR. TOO MANY ASSUMPTIONS.

No more unfair than the opposite statement.

15. It is good that big energy and corporate America are the two biggest contributors to the Republican Party.

THAT IS FAIR.
16. The present tax rates, while lower than almost any first world nation, should be slashed further, even at the cost of providing basic emergency services.

THAT IS FAIR UNTIL YOU GET TO BASIC EMERGENCY SERVICES. THAT TERM NEEDS TO BE DEFINED. WHETHER OR NOT THIS IS A CONSERVATIVE POSITION DEPENDS ON WHAT YOUR DEFINITION OF EMERGENCY SERVICES IS.

17. Ethics codes on college campuses are good and promote American values.

THAT IS FAIR.

Now: what's the difference?

18. War is a better way of solving disputes between countries than agreed upon arbitration.

NOT FAIR.

Why not?

19. Other countries should never have differing opinions about whether the United States is doing the right thing, and if they do, we should invade them.

TOTALLY RIDICULOUS. NO CONSERVATIVE I KNOW TAKES THIS POSITION.

So we *should* listen to our allies. I *knew* you were a closet Democrat.

20. It is bad that colleges have created hundreds of women's sports teams.

SOME CONSERVATIVES MIGHT AGREE WITH THIS BUT NOT MOST.

This was as fair as the statement it was in response to.

21. Racial profiling for terrorists is the only mechanism that should be used to find terrorists. Behaviorial clues are irrelevant to determining actual treats compared to the color of one's skin or last name.

THAT IS RIDICULOUS. NO CONSERVATIVE THINKS THAT RACIAL PROFILING IS THE ONLY WAY TO FIND TERRORITSTS. BUT MOST CONSERVATIVES THINK THAT RACIAL PROFILING SHOULD BE ONE OF THE TOOLS.

Well then, the statement was too simplistic. Once again.

22. Being morally corrupt and ignorant and stupid -- not a complex interaction of a multitude of social forces -- are the primary causes of violent crime in the inner city.

I DON'T KNOW ANYONE WHO BELIEVE THIS

No, this is an underlying tenant of conservatism, that people who are poor are poor because of their own moral and intellectual failures. I just put a particularly ugly face on it.

23. WASP culture is morally superior to any other.

ALTHOUGH THEY WOULDN'T ADMIT IT, I KNOW MANY CONSERVATIVES WHO BELIEVE THIS. I THINK IT WOULD INCLUDE MORE CONSERVATIVES IF YOU MADE IT "AMERICAN CULTURE" BECAUSE OF ALL THE CONSERVATIVE CATHOLICS.

You agreed, or sort of agreed, with about a third of the items. Are you a liberal, or do you not realize that this "test" is bullshit?

Furrowed brow, gnawed pencil.
 

Shush. Spanky put a lot of time and effort into really engaging and wrestling with each of the questions on those lists. I am not sure what to make of Balt's engagement with Spanky's answers, however.

Furrowed brow, gnawed pencil.
 

I conclude that both of them are unemployed.

CDF (hey, y'all)

Are you a liberal?
 

I believe that you should blow me.

Does that make me a liberal?

S_A_M

Present for Spanky.

Don't say I never gave you anything.

I don't think I am an arch conservative. Or even a conservative. I consider my self a moderate. So I think it is fair. I think on many of them Balt just did not like to face the logical conclusion of liberal positions.

Most certainly racial profiling and the exclusionary rule. If you are against racial profiling you think that an old white women and a Saudi young male should get the same scrutiny. That is a fact he clealry does not want to face. He is trying to pretend the issue is how important racial profiling is in searching for terrorists. That is not the issue. The issue is whether or not it is used at all and the majority of liberals don't think it should be used at all.

Same with the exclusionary rule. If you favor the exclusionary rule then you favor a system that will let clearly guilty murderers and child molesters go if their rights have been violated.

I am against school vouchers and so it Balt. However, he does not want to accept thefact that if you are against school vouchers you are against letting poor people choose to send their children to private schools.

Every position you take does has negative consequences. Balt seems to get angry when these obvious consequences of liberal positions are exposed.

Most school-voucher programs do not provide enough money for poor people to choose to send their children to private schools. They give enough to help middle-class families pay the tuition, but not a full ride.

Most of the proposed voucher programs I have reviewed provided enough money for anyone to afford to go to Catholic School. Since the Catholic church manages to spend much less per pupil on education, even in such a system there is money left over for the public school system even though the kid isn't using it. In other words the money currently allocated per student for their education would only be half used to enable all kids to go to Catholic school.

Somebody is not happy.....
 

The Republican Majority for Choice is outraged by the act of South Dakota Governor Mike Rounds signing a bill this week that outlaws abortion even for victims of rape and incest. By showing total disregard for the most vulnerable of crime victims and enacting a law that would put doctors behind bars for attempting to help these victims, proponents of this law have finally shown their true colors as fundamentalists with a single purpose.

Click here to read RMC's Op-Ed featured Wednesday in the Philadelphia Inquirer denouncing Governor Rounds' action and calling for the Real Republican Majority to reclaim our Party as one of compassion, inclusion and limited government intrusion.

This week, we have seen how the women and families of America suffer when good Republicans allow this far right faction to use our Party as a vehicle to promote these most extreme and outrageous laws.

Unfortunately, there are several other state legislatures considering similar bans -- Real Republicans cannot sit by and let this injustice continue. We are committed to stopping the further erosion of victims' rights and protecting our personal freedom.

WE NEED YOUR HELP in standing up for victims' rights.

As compassionate Real Republicans we must ensure that no other Governor will disregard protections for victims of rape and incest and ignore the basic right to privacy and personal freedom. Please make a donation today and help us spread our message of hope, care and compassion nationwide. Please click here to join our Real Republican Team and take action today.

Another easy example of why the "liberal test" isn't "fair"--Isn't that Racial, Age and Sex profiling? Isn't the fair comparison whether an old white woman and an old Arab woman should get the same scrutiny?

In any case, it should be easy enough to justify scrutiny for Yemenis or Pakistanis or whatever without relying on overbroad "racial" profiling.