LawTalkers - A sad, constant bid for attention

Quote:

Originally posted by taxwonk
So educate this ignorant white boy. What's the difference between rap and hip-hop. What makes one artist mainstream and another underground?

Everyone argues about what rap is and what hip hop is all the time. Here is my take:

Rap is a form of music. It is the art of speaking in ryhme over a beat. There are subsets of rap music. Hip hop is a subset.

The subset of hip hop comes from hip hop culture. Hip hop culture was born in the slums along with break dancing, dj-ing, style and grafitti. DJs used to have parties, MCs would hype the DJs, who were the real stars and crews would battle each other by breakdancing. As the parties and music evolved, the DJ's role became less of the focus and the MC's rhymes, more. Hip hop music is music that embraces the hip hop culture and is true to its origins. Artists who have a sense of hip hop history, who make music where the focus is lyrical skill, carry on hip hop styles with their fashion sense and are primarily interested in the art form and their target audience first and making money second are thought of as hip hop artists. Hip hop artists elevate the DJ and work in conjunction with the music in a sort of give and take with it and the DJ. Hip hop artists live a hip hop lifestyle.

Anyone can be a rapper. Rappers rhyme over beats. Mainstream rap is formulaic and predictable. Rhyme about violence, drugs, your money and hoes. Rappers live a lifestyle that is about money and (often pretend) violence. Most rap music is bullshit.

Hip hop artists cross over into mainstream rap sometimes, but never the other way around. Jay-Z is adept at both. He is lyrically skilled and respected by the hip hop community. He puts out rap albums and prints money. But he is down with every single hip hop artist and keeps his hip hop roots legit by appearing on their albums, underground or not.

Fifty Cent tries to do the same thing, but I think he's mostly a jackass. He started off on mix tapes and earned some respect by attacking other artists because they weren't about hip hop, but selling records, accusing them of making sing-songy crap (like Ja-Rule). And then he got a taste of that money and did the same shit.

True underground artists don't really have huge record deals and make most of their money off of live appearances. They don't sell out, stay true to their hip hop principles and rap about things that will never sell. See Dead Prez's lyrics to their song Hip Hop and then imagine Clear Channel playing that shit:

Uh, uh, uh, 1, 2, 1, 2
Uh, uh, 1, 2, 1, 2, uh, uh
All my dogs

Hook

Its bigger than hip hop, hip hop, hip hop, hip
Its bigger than hip hop, hip hop, hip hop, hip hop

Uh, one thing bout music, when it hit you feel no pain
White folks say it controls your brain
I know better than that, thats game and we ready for that
Two soldiers head of the pack, matter of fact who got the gat?
And where my army at?
Rather attack and not react
Back the beats, it dont reflect on how many records get sold
On sex, drugs, and rock and roll, whether your projects put on hold
In the real world, these just people with ideas
They just like me and you when the smoke and camera disappear
Again the real world (world), its bigger than all these fake ass records
When poor folks got the millions and my womans disrespected
If you check 1,2, my word of advice to you is just relax
Just do what you got to do, if that dont work then kick the facts
If you a fighter, rider, ? bouter? , flame ignitor, crowd exciter
Or you wanna just get high, then just say it
But then if you a liar-liar, pants on fire, wolf-cry agent with a wire
Im gonna know it when I play it

Hook

Uh, who shot biggie smalls?
If we dont get them, they gonna get us all
Im down for runnin up on them crackers in they city hall
We ride for yall, all my dogs stay real
Nigga dont think these record deals gonna feed your seeds
And pay your bills because they not
Mcs get a little bit of love and think they hot
Talkin bout how much money they got, all yall records sound the same
I sick of that fake thug, r & b, rap scenario all day on the radio
Same scenes in the video, monotonous material, yall dont here me though
These record labels slang our tapes like dope
You can be next in line, and signed, and still be writing rhymes and broke
You would rather have a lexus, some justice, a dream or some substance?
A beamer, a necklace or freedom?
Still a nigga like me dont playa hate, I just stay awake
This real hip hop, and it dont stop until we get the po-po off the block
They call it....

Hook
_____________
Or Dead Prez's Hell Yeah, featuring Jay-Z:

[Jay-Z]

We together on the same track now, baby!
Whatchu gon call us now?!

[Intro]

Holton Street, Dean Street (click clack)
Prezident (uh huh) Nostrand Ave (DP's) (Marcy)
Orange Al (RBGs) T-Town (Who wanna ride?)
Brooklyn, Come on, Come on

[Verse - stic.man]

Sittin' in the living room on the floor
Hunger pain got me on some migraine shit
But I'm a maintain
Nigga got 2 or 3 dollars to my name
And my homies in the same boat going through the same thing
Ready for our cake, steady plottin for the paper
We been living in the dark since April
On the candle, gotta get a handle
My homie got a 25 automatic added to the gamble
Nigga get the phone book look up in the yellow page
Lemme tell you how we fend to get paid
We gonna order pizza and when we see the driver
We gonna stick the 25 up in his face
Lets ride, stepping outside like warriors
Head to the notorious Southside
One weapon to the four of us
Hiding in the corridor until we see the Dominos car headlights
White boy in the wrong place at the right time
Soon as the car door open up he mine
We roll up quick and put the pistol to his nose
By the look on his face he probably shitted in his clothes
You know what this is, it's a stick up
Gimme the dough from your pickups
You ran into the wrong niggaz
We running down the block hot with these pizza boxes
So we split up and met back at the apartment

[Chorus]

Hell yeah (yo ain't you hungry my nigga?)
Hell yeah (you wanna get paid my nigga?)
Hell yeah (ain't you tired of starving my nigga?)
Hell yeah (well lets ride then)
Hell yeah, Hell yeah

[Verse - M-1]

I know a way we can get paid
You can get down but you can't be afraid
Let's go to the DMV, and get a ID
The name says you but the face is me
Now it's your turn take my paper work
Like 1, 2, 3 lets make it work
Then, fill out the credit card application
And it's gonna be bout 3 weeks of waiting
For American Express, Discovery Card
Platinum Visa, Master Card
Cause, when you was spooked as shit then we was targets
Now we just walk right up and say charge it
To the game we rocking brand names
Well known at Department Store chains
Even got the boys in the crew a few things
Po Po never know who to true blame
Store after store you know we kept rolling
Wait two weeks report the car stolen
Repeat this cycle like a like a laundry mat
Like a glitch in the system it's hard to catch
Coming out the mall with the shopping bags
We can take it right back then get the cash
Yeah, get a friend and then do it again
Damn right that's how we paid the rent (hell yeah)

[Bridge - repeat 2x]

Got to get this paper
I'm down for the caper, we steady on the grind
It's a daily struggle, we all gotta hustle
This is the way we survive

[Verse - Jay-Z]

As long as there's - drugs to be sold
I ain't waiting for the system to plug up these holes
I ain't slipping through the cracks
So I'm at Portland, Oregon tryin to slip you these raps
The first black in the suburbs
You'd think I had extasy, percocet, and plus syrup
The way the cops converged, they fucked up my swerve
The first young buck that I served
I thought back to the block
I never seen a cop when I was out there
They never came out there
And out there, I was slinging crack to live
I'm only slinging raps to your kids
I'm only trying to show you how black niggaz live
But you don't want your little ones acting like this
Lil Amy told Becky, Becky told Jenny
And now they all know the skinny
Lil Joey got his do-rag on
Driving down the street blasting Tupac's song (Thug Life baby!)
But Billy like Sue, got his blue rag on
Now before you know it, you backing em
Now the police, got me in the middle of the street
Trying to beat me blue, black and orange
I'm like hold up, who you smacking on?
I'm only trying to eat what you snacking on

[Chorus] (Jay-Z)

Hell yeah (y'all don't like that do you?)
Hell yeah (you fucked up the hood nigga right back to you)
Hell yeah (you know we tired of starving my nigga)
Hell yeah (let's ride) hell yeahhh (let's ride)

[Bridge - repeat 2x] (w/ Jay-Z ad-libs)

If you claiming gangsta
Then bang on the system
And show that you ready to ride
Till we get our freedom
We got to get over
We steady on the grind

Quote:

Originally posted by ThurgreedMarshall
Everyone argues about what rap is and what hip hop is all the time. Here is my take:

Rap is a form of music. It is the art of speaking in ryhme over a beat. There are subsets of rap music. Hip hop is a subset.

The subset of hip hop comes from hip hop culture. Hip hop culture was born in the slums along with break dancing, dj-ing, style and grafitti. DJs used to have parties, MCs would hype the DJs, who were the real stars and crews would battle each other by breakdancing. As the parties and music evolved, the DJ's role became less of the focus and the MC's rhymes, more. Hip hop music is music that embraces the hip hop culture and is true to its origins. Artists who have a sense of hip hop history, who make music where the focus is lyrical skill, carry on hip hop styles with their fashion sense and are primarily interested in the art form and their target audience first and making money second are thought of as hip hop artists. Hip hop artists elevate the DJ and work in conjunction with the music in a sort of give and take with it and the DJ. Hip hop artists live a hip hop lifestyle.

Anyone can be a rapper. Rappers rhyme over beats. Mainstream rap is formulaic and predictable. Rhyme about violence, drugs, your money and hoes. Rappers live a lifestyle that is about money and (often pretend) violence. Most rap music is bullshit.

Hip hop artists cross over into mainstream rap sometimes, but never the other way around. Jay-Z is adept at both. He is lyrically skilled and respected by the hip hop community. He puts out rap albums and prints money. But he is down with every single hip hop artist and keeps his hip hop roots legit by appearing on their albums, underground or not.

Fifty Cent tries to do the same thing, but I think he's mostly a jackass. He started off on mix tapes and earned some respect by attacking other artists because they weren't about hip hop, but selling records, accusing them of making sing-songy crap (like Ja-Rule). And then he got a taste of that money and did the same shit.

True underground artists don't really have huge record deals and make most of their money off of live appearances. They don't sell out, stay true to their hip hop principles and rap about things that will never sell. See Dead Prez's lyrics to their song Hip Hop and then imagine Clear Channel playing that shit:

Uh, uh, uh, 1, 2, 1, 2
Uh, uh, 1, 2, 1, 2, uh, uh
All my dogs

Hook

Its bigger than hip hop, hip hop, hip hop, hip
Its bigger than hip hop, hip hop, hip hop, hip hop

Uh, one thing bout music, when it hit you feel no pain
White folks say it controls your brain
I know better than that, thats game and we ready for that
Two soldiers head of the pack, matter of fact who got the gat?
And where my army at?
Rather attack and not react
Back the beats, it dont reflect on how many records get sold
On sex, drugs, and rock and roll, whether your projects put on hold
In the real world, these just people with ideas
They just like me and you when the smoke and camera disappear
Again the real world (world), its bigger than all these fake ass records
When poor folks got the millions and my womans disrespected
If you check 1,2, my word of advice to you is just relax
Just do what you got to do, if that dont work then kick the facts
If you a fighter, rider, ? bouter? , flame ignitor, crowd exciter
Or you wanna just get high, then just say it
But then if you a liar-liar, pants on fire, wolf-cry agent with a wire
Im gonna know it when I play it

Hook

Uh, who shot biggie smalls?
If we dont get them, they gonna get us all
Im down for runnin up on them crackers in they city hall
We ride for yall, all my dogs stay real
Nigga dont think these record deals gonna feed your seeds
And pay your bills because they not
Mcs get a little bit of love and think they hot
Talkin bout how much money they got, all yall records sound the same
I sick of that fake thug, r & b, rap scenario all day on the radio
Same scenes in the video, monotonous material, yall dont here me though
These record labels slang our tapes like dope
You can be next in line, and signed, and still be writing rhymes and broke
You would rather have a lexus, some justice, a dream or some substance?
A beamer, a necklace or freedom?
Still a nigga like me dont playa hate, I just stay awake
This real hip hop, and it dont stop until we get the po-po off the block
They call it....

Hook
_____________
Or Dead Prez's Hell Yeah, featuring Jay-Z:

[Jay-Z]

We together on the same track now, baby!
Whatchu gon call us now?!

[Intro]

Holton Street, Dean Street (click clack)
Prezident (uh huh) Nostrand Ave (DP's) (Marcy)
Orange Al (RBGs) T-Town (Who wanna ride?)
Brooklyn, Come on, Come on

[Verse - stic.man]

Sittin' in the living room on the floor
Hunger pain got me on some migraine shit
But I'm a maintain
Nigga got 2 or 3 dollars to my name
And my homies in the same boat going through the same thing
Ready for our cake, steady plottin for the paper
We been living in the dark since April
On the candle, gotta get a handle
My homie got a 25 automatic added to the gamble
Nigga get the phone book look up in the yellow page
Lemme tell you how we fend to get paid
We gonna order pizza and when we see the driver
We gonna stick the 25 up in his face
Lets ride, stepping outside like warriors
Head to the notorious Southside
One weapon to the four of us
Hiding in the corridor until we see the Dominos car headlights
White boy in the wrong place at the right time
Soon as the car door open up he mine
We roll up quick and put the pistol to his nose
By the look on his face he probably shitted in his clothes
You know what this is, it's a stick up
Gimme the dough from your pickups
You ran into the wrong niggaz
We running down the block hot with these pizza boxes
So we split up and met back at the apartment

[Chorus]

Hell yeah (yo ain't you hungry my nigga?)
Hell yeah (you wanna get paid my nigga?)
Hell yeah (ain't you tired of starving my nigga?)
Hell yeah (well lets ride then)
Hell yeah, Hell yeah

[Verse - M-1]

I know a way we can get paid
You can get down but you can't be afraid
Let's go to the DMV, and get a ID
The name says you but the face is me
Now it's your turn take my paper work
Like 1, 2, 3 lets make it work
Then, fill out the credit card application
And it's gonna be bout 3 weeks of waiting
For American Express, Discovery Card
Platinum Visa, Master Card
Cause, when you was spooked as shit then we was targets
Now we just walk right up and say charge it
To the game we rocking brand names
Well known at Department Store chains
Even got the boys in the crew a few things
Po Po never know who to true blame
Store after store you know we kept rolling
Wait two weeks report the car stolen
Repeat this cycle like a like a laundry mat
Like a glitch in the system it's hard to catch
Coming out the mall with the shopping bags
We can take it right back then get the cash
Yeah, get a friend and then do it again
Damn right that's how we paid the rent (hell yeah)

[Bridge - repeat 2x]

Got to get this paper
I'm down for the caper, we steady on the grind
It's a daily struggle, we all gotta hustle
This is the way we survive

[Verse - Jay-Z]

As long as there's - drugs to be sold
I ain't waiting for the system to plug up these holes
I ain't slipping through the cracks
So I'm at Portland, Oregon tryin to slip you these raps
The first black in the suburbs
You'd think I had extasy, percocet, and plus syrup
The way the cops converged, they fucked up my swerve
The first young buck that I served
I thought back to the block
I never seen a cop when I was out there
They never came out there
And out there, I was slinging crack to live
I'm only slinging raps to your kids
I'm only trying to show you how black niggaz live
But you don't want your little ones acting like this
Lil Amy told Becky, Becky told Jenny
And now they all know the skinny
Lil Joey got his do-rag on
Driving down the street blasting Tupac's song (Thug Life baby!)
But Billy like Sue, got his blue rag on
Now before you know it, you backing em
Now the police, got me in the middle of the street
Trying to beat me blue, black and orange
I'm like hold up, who you smacking on?
I'm only trying to eat what you snacking on

[Chorus] (Jay-Z)

Hell yeah (y'all don't like that do you?)
Hell yeah (you fucked up the hood nigga right back to you)
Hell yeah (you know we tired of starving my nigga)
Hell yeah (let's ride) hell yeahhh (let's ride)

[Bridge - repeat 2x] (w/ Jay-Z ad-libs)

If you claiming gangsta
Then bang on the system
And show that you ready to ride
Till we get our freedom
We got to get over
We steady on the grind

Both in heavy rotation on my iPod. Well played, playa.