Biased Questions?
 

Cousin whose husband is fighting in Afghanistan -- and who fits the undecided category -- wants to know why Kerry was the only one who wanted to talk about Afghanistan. He may be swinging her.

Biased Questions?
 

What did Kerry have to say about Afghanistan other than we let Afghan warlords go after OBL. He had nothing productive to say and nothing of substance to say.

FYI - OBL is dead. We may never find his body.

Debates
 

West Palm is not 100% Jewish Ty. And guess what? If you were a gentile living in a county that is 85% Jewish people over the age of 75, you might start agreeing with the Nazi parts of Buchanan's platform more then you do now.


In-laws visiting this weekend!

Biased Questions?
 

Well, I've never gotten a witness to break down and give me an admission, nor have I ever seen one. You just hammer away, forcing him to say implausible, absurd things, and those little absurdities build up until the audience or jury says "Fuck, this guy has no credibility."

You never convert the rabid partisans, but you do get the swing voters. This whole election is Bush betting on the people who give him a pass on his obvious lies or are too stupid to recognize the lies outnumbering the swing voters who get sick of his lies and vote ABB.

Debates
 

Did you remind the little tot that Kerry never says the same thing twice?

Your 8 year old must also not be responding to post-debate Gallup polls:

***Demonstrated he is tough enough for the job Bush 54/ Kerry
37
***Likable Bush 48/Kerry 41
***Believable Bush 48 / Kerry 45
***Agreed with you more on the issues you care about Bush 49/ Kerry 46
***Had a good understanding of the issues 41/41
***Expressed himself more clearly Bush 32/Kerry 60

On Iraq: Before Debate: 54 said the president would do a better job handling Iraq than Kerry (40)
After: 54/43

Kerry needed to bond with the American people. All he did was demonstrate (1) he is better public speaker, (2) he is taller, and (3) he doesn't know the difference between a Nazi death camp and an Russian outpost.

lost amid the debating
 

TDS nailed the (uncanny!) similarities the same evening after Allawi's remarks. WaPo's falling down on the job.

Debates
 

This is my take on it, too (as I stated last night). Joe average american isn't impressed by the skills one learns in debate club. Not saying joe average american is someone to be admired or someone to emulate. However, am saying that joe average american will decide this election. Not the intelligensia. So it really doesn't matter if Kerry doesn't know the difference between a Nazi death camp and a Russian outpost. But it does matter if joe average american doesn't like or identify with Kerry.

Hell, even most Dems don't like or identify with Kerry. They just hate Bush more than they don't like Kerry.

2. It was a stupid line, and I expected Rudy to do much better.

I did like the Indecision '04 special last night, though, particularly the faux-spin room bit:

"Jon, the Kerry camp would like to remind everyone that Kerry was raised by rich, French Communist homosexuals. He never should've been able to connect with the common man. He wins this debate!"

"Jon, the Bush camp reminds you that Kerry is the smartest.man.in.the.world. The President never should have won this debate. The President, you should know, under some tests has qualified as borderline retarded. A retarded man beat a Senator tonight, Jon! You've got to reelect this man!"

Multi-nationism
 

Apparently, James Lileks heard enough last night, and boy he seems ticked today.

Best part

• But mostly I hate the debates because I simply cannot abide hearing certain statements I’ve been hearing over, and over, and over again. I can’t take any more talk about bringing allies to the table. Which ones? Brazil? Mynmar? Microfrickin’nesia? Are there some incredibly important and powerful nations out there whose existence has hitherto escaped me? Fermany? Gerance? The Galactic Order of the Belgian Dominion? Did we piss off the Vulcans? Who? If we mean “France and Germany,” then please explain to me why the reluctant participation of these two countries somehow bestows the magic kiss of legitimacy. They want in? Fine. They don’t? Fine. At this point mooning over France is like being that sophomore loser dorm pal who spent his dateless weekends telling his loser roommate about a high school sweetheart who stood him up for the prom. Give it up. Move on. I understand; they are wise and nuanced, we are young and dumb. We’re the cowboy leaning with his back against the bar, elbows on the rail, watching the door; we need our European betters to teach us how to ape the subtle forms of Nijinsky, limbs arrayed in the exquisite form of the Dying Swan. Understood. But I don’t want to be the Dying Swan. And I don’t want posture lessons from a country that spent the last 20 years flopping on its back and grabbing its ankles when Saddam showed up waving stacks of Francs in exchange for bang-sticks. Don’t you think I know about France’s relations with Saddam? Surely the advocates of the French Touch must know, and don’t care. Or they don’t know – in which case their advice is useless.
  
  Germany? Whatever.
  
  And it took lots of dead Americans to be able to say that.
  
  Also dead Russians. Is Russia the great ally we’ve dissed? If we invite Russia to help, then we have to tell them things. I don’t want to tell them things. At least as they relate to the battlefield.
  
  Perhaps the “ally” is that big blue wobbly mass known as the UN, that paragon of moral clarity, that conscience of the globe. You want to really anger a UN official? Tow his car. Short of that you can get away with anything. (Sudan is on the human rights commission, to cite a prominent and amusing detail. It’s like putting Tony Soprano on the New Jersey Waste Management Regulation Board.) I don’t worry that the UN is angry with us. I’d be worried if they weren’t. And I find it interesting that someone who would complain about outsourcing peevishly notes that we hired <psycho screeching strings> HALLIBURTON </strings> to do the work instead of throwing buckets of billions to French and German contractors who sold them the jets and built the bunkers.
  
  I’ve been hearing this shite for years! That’s why I can’t stand the debates! ENOUGH WITH FRANCE AND GERMANY!
  
  (pause; huffing into a plastic bag to restore blood chemistry)

Biased Questions?
 

I hear you loud and clear. You make a fine point - why not Iraq? We had to start somewhere and it was in the middle of everything and an easily winnable war. But when you attack a third party on a comically bad pretext, you cede the necessary moral authority behind the pre-emption. You need the moral authority here. We had it in Afghanistan, we had it in Pakistan. We could have pressed Musharraf to let us into the provinces and run roughshod through the whole place, taking out madrases left and right, really making an impact on the brand of Islam we're up against. Instead we're in Iraq, one of the few places where a secular dictator did not allow radical Islam to flourish. The war should out in the desert in Afghanistan and Pakistan, further from Israel and the Middle East. Instead, we've moved it right next door to Israel and put it next to Saudi Arabia, the biggest source of militant islam in the world.

Biased Questions?
 

You missed the critical part on Afghanistan - that invading Iraq diverted attention from the critical fight in Afghanistan. This is the reality our soldiers in Afghanistan feel every day of the week. Bush's cavalier "we can do both" ignores the frustrations being faced on a daily basis by those fighting in this half-forgetten country that just happens to be more populous than Iraq and have tougher, more diverse terrain.

Debates
 

The debate ended roughly 15 or so hours ago. How scientifically accurate do you think those numbers are? Fuck polls. I hate Bush and Kerry and I'd score it this way:

Bush won the first 30 min.

Kerry won the next 60 min.

If you prefer a football score, I'd say Kerry won 24-17. This morning I said Kerry won by a field goal. I now amend that after watching some streaming video. Bush looked like he'd shot all his talking points early and had no original thoughts later in the debate.

Oh, BTW, I don't know if its true, but MoveOn is alleging Gallup's owner is a Jesus Freak, so, in addition to discounting the polls because a poll based on something that took place 15 hrs ago - prior to most respondents' going to bed - is a piece of shit by necessity, its also worth considering the source.

I'd rethink offering poll numbers as proof of anything.

Biased Questions?
 

What do we need the moral authority for? To get help from France and Germany? Yeah, I am sure that if only we had France and Germany on our side, we could win the war on islamic terrorism.

Get real.

Debates
 

I liked the stuff about Poland being a crucial coalition member on TDS last night.

So the RNC did mass mailings in West Virginia and Arkansas that basically said if you vote for Democrats, they will ban the Bible? Charming.

Guiliani would suck off W and swish the load around in his mouth if he thought it would get him to higher office. Rudy's a whore, plain and simple. I've seen him say some amazingly ridiculous things in support of Bush recently. He's suspended disbelief and is just taking orders from the party. Rudy won't speak any sense until after Nov 2, at which point he'll suddenly regain consciousness.

Biased Questions?
 

And Iraq is a much more effective strategy because?

Debates
 

Agreed, and I point out that 3 other polls show Kerry as the clear winner.

http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmp.../debate_rdp_32

Sebby, I know you like you're tax cut, but do you really want W appointing Supreme Court justices? A few of 'em are teeterin' on the brink (though I'd never pick one for a Death Pool -- they always seem to be able to teeter for a while) and the concept of a W-packed Supreme Court is just plain frightening.

I re-watched the debate on c-span, where they had full-time split screens showing both candidates. This is the impression I got of W.

eta: Faces of Frustration Video

Biased Questions?
 

I didn't miss any points. I understand the Dem position is that iraq was the wrong war to fight. I think you are wrong. I think the only solution to the problems Islam has inflicted on this earth is to bring democracy to the middle east so that the people who live better lives and will be less focused on this religion and, thus, less focused on killing us.

You and I just disagree on the solution to islamic terrorism. We can't kill them all. More bombs in Afghanistan won't solve the terrorist mills in the Arab world. Democracy and capitalism in the middle east and a viable middle class is the only solution that will bring an end to the horrors that islam has wrought on the world.

Debates
 

I'm truly conflicted. Its fucking hard. My soul is ABB, but my fiscal conservative leanings are frightened by JFK. I may just close my eyes and mash my hand onto the levers and turn and walk out without looking at what I did. That way I can blame it on Jesus.

Biased Questions?
 

See my post supra to GGG. We can't kill all potential muslim terrorists. Some chick wearing a scarf living in a tent pumps out a new islamic terrorist as fast as we can kill them. The only solution to this problem is to bring democracy and capitalism and a middle class to the middle east. Give people hope for a better life and they will stop clinging to these extreme religions.

When your life sucks because you live in a totalitarian state run by mullahs who enforce their fucked up beyond belief beliefs on everyone by a fucking religious police force, you cling to idiotic beliefs like blowing your self up for the chance to fuck 72 virgins in heaven.

People who have good lives on earth don't think so much about an after life. They want to keep living and they aren't as susceptible to these cults.

Debates
 

I hear you. But what is fiscally conservative about this? Somebody's gotta pay for this sooner or later.

Debates
 

Who wouldn't be frustrated being forced to listen to that jackass for 90 minutes?

My god, I'm merely impressed Bush didn't walk over and slap him when he said that lie about the NYC subway.

Biased Questions?
 

Islam is the problem.

Iraq was secular.

Now its full of Islam.

We did that.

We could have just fought Islam where it already was - where the terrorists who killed 3000 of us are still.

We're not doing that.

That's not explainable, morally or logically.

Iraq is a blunder.

Bad judgment should not be rewarded with four more years.

Debates
 

Ever see the Wanderers? Don't fuck with the Polish?, er...

Debates
 

I missed that part -- wasn't mentioned on the "truth squad" pieces I heard deconstructing the debate.

What was the lie?

Debates
 

2, only the lie W told about there being 100,000-strong force of trained Iraqis to take over Iraqi security. The man can't open his mouth without telling a lie.

Debates
 

That they closed the subways.

Apparently, Kerry can't tell the difference between the DNC and the RNC, and TCOTU and a shit town like Boston.

Multi-nationism
 

I thought Microfrickin'nesia was already at the table, according to your coalition list. They sent some sea shells or something, as I remember.

lost amid the debating
 

Do you not think that there are legitimate reasons why what he says should be coordinated? National security reasons perhaps?

Debates
 

Comedy involves taking risks, Hank, but I wouldn't have gone there myself.

Debates
 

Did he say "fully" trained?

Biased Questions?
 

Exactly. Now the islamic terrorists blow up Iraqi children on Arab soil, not our children on US soil. The downside of this (and this is not to be taken lightly) is that US soldiers also die and get maimed.

Iraq = flypaper.

However, there is no evidence that the Iraqis are any more or less secular or religious now. All that has happened is that foreign islamicists have invaded Iraq. Instead of attacking us, which they would have been doing if they weren't now in Iraq.

You mean Saudi Arabia? That is where those terrorists came from. You prepared to give up your gas-guzzling SUV or are you still driving with OBL next to you.

Debates
 

A few thoughts:
- I actually think Bush may have been hurt by the rules his side pushed for, esp the "no direct questions" rule. Instead of repeating his soundbites later in the debate he could have start posing "when did you stop beating your wife" questions about Kerry's alleged flipfloppery. I understand they were worried about Kerry pouncing on Bush with his prosecutorial cross examination techniques that worked so well against Weld, but I think it was just as likely that any such questioning would have backfired on Kerry, made him seem too shrill. Esp based on the comments I've read on here since the debate.

- I don't think Kerry did as well as some do, but he certainly found a way to discipline his answers a little better than he normally does on the stump. Maybe the campaign should bring the box with the little colored lights with them when he campaigns.

- I am developing a facial tic every time Bush says "we brought the network of AQ Khan to justice."

- While the polls have said for several months that GWB's strength is national security, I think he's going to be in a much better position for debates on domestic issues. I mean, them undecideds may not know much about bilateral negotiations, but they sure do know what the term "tax relief" means. All Bush has to do while Kerry talks about his health plan is to rub his thumb and forefinger together while he's on the split screen. I can just hear the undecideds now. "Taxes....the thumb and forefinger thing means the big Frenchman wants to raise our taxes...." Bush wanted to do something like that last night but had to check himself.

- As I said yesterday, it is honestly weird how it doesn't matter what I, or anyone who cares enough about politics to follow current events, thinks about this debate.

Biased Questions?
 

And ponies. Once we give everyone in the Middle East a pony, they'll all be too happy and busy with their ponies to focus on killing us. If they'd only stop shooting for long enough for us to get the ponies distributed.

lost amid the debating
 

Then it probably should have been nat security types instead of campaign types, don't you think?

Debates
 

BUSH: Let me first tell you that the best way for Iraq to be safe and secure is for Iraqi citizens to be trained to do the job.

And that's what we're doing. We've got 100,000 trained now, 125,000 by the end of this year, 200,000 by the end of next year.

http://www.thekcrachannel.com/politi...96/detail.html

Debates
 

Easy there, pardner. You elect Kerry, and he's still got to deal with a GOP Congress, which means less wasteful spending, but the only taxes that get enacted are passed over Tom DeLay's dead body.

Debates
 

The President of Poland recently said about Bush et al.:

• They deceived us about the weapons of mass destruction, that's true. We were taken for a ride.

lost amid the debating
 

Pray tell, what are the national security reasons to have a representative of the Bush-Cheney campaign helping to write Allawi's speech?

And for the love of God, think about what you're saying. If the U.S. is "coordinating" what he says with what the President says, that makes him a puppet. You're not disagreeing with Lockhart any more, you're just saying that we need a puppet there so we can bring democracy to them.

Biased Questions?
 

Bribes won't work, either.

Democracy and a viable middle class will free the middle east from the chains of islam. Nothing else short of anilation via nuclear bomb will stop the evils that islam has perpetrated on the rest of us. I don't think the american people support bombing the arab world off the face of the earth.