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sebastian_dangerfield 02-22-2006 12:49 PM

Port (not wine) Issue
 
Quote:

Originally posted by Mmmm, Burger (C.J.)
You are correct. However, the British government did not own the company; the UAE does own (or control) the acquiring company.
So? Whats the relevance of that distinction? Would you be more comfortable with a private Dubai contractor buying that British firm?

If anything, that the purchasing entity is state controlled augurs in favor of Bush's position.

But don't let me stop a good scandal. Carry on, by all means. And cite some bloggers for support. I'm really interested to hear what Kos has to say about it.

ETA: I will give you this... This GOP and Dem hand wringing over a non-issue shows the parties can unite when it comes to making asses of themselves.

Mmmm, Burger (C.J.) 02-22-2006 01:20 PM

Port (not wine) Issue
 
Quote:

Originally posted by sebastian_dangerfield
So? Whats the relevance of that distinction? Would you be more comfortable with a private Dubai contractor buying that British firm?

I have a hard time seeing a distinction that matters, but I suppose the thinking is that with more direct government control, they could directly infiltrate the company with their supposed terrorist program and implement it in US ports, whereas a privately held company would resist those efforts. Considering how compliant (or complicit) the telcos have been in assisting NSA's unlawful domestic surveillance program, I'm not sure it matters a whit whether a company is government owned.

ETA: And if anyone things a privately owned company will impose adequate security to the point that government oversight and security is obviated, well, go ahead and let the airlines run security like they did pre-9/11.

sebastian_dangerfield 02-22-2006 01:25 PM

Port (not wine) Issue
 
Quote:

Originally posted by Mmmm, Burger (C.J.)
I have a hard time seeing a distinction that matters, but I suppose the thinking is that with more direct government control, they could directly infiltrate the company with their supposed terrorist program and implement it in US ports, whereas a privately held company would resist those efforts.
I don't know that is, but "thinking" is not the noun I'd choose.

SlaveNoMore 02-22-2006 01:33 PM

Port (yes, whine) Issue
 
Quote:

Tyrone Slothrop
That said, it's delightful to see all these conservatives who were falling all over themselves last week explaining how Bush can wiretap people people regardless of the laws Congress passed this week explaining that they're going to pass a law because they don't like a national-security decision that the President made.
Is this inconsistency akin to the liberals being against the port deal on the basis of "racial profiling"?

Tyrone Slothrop 02-22-2006 01:36 PM

Port (yes, whine) Issue
 
Quote:

Originally posted by SlaveNoMore
Is this inconsistency akin to the liberals being against the port deal on the basis of "racial profiling"?
No.

eta:

But thanks for asking.

And if it is, I don't really care about whether liberals (?) are being hypocritical here -- I care much more about the separation of powers and whether previously supine Republicans in the House and Senate are going to let Bush get away with announcing that he can violate the law if he asserts a national-security angle.

SlaveNoMore 02-22-2006 01:36 PM

Port (not wine) Issue
 
Quote:

sebastian_dangerfield
ETA: I will give you this... This GOP and Dem hand wringing over a non-issue shows the parties can unite when it comes to making asses of themselves.
2

SlaveNoMore 02-22-2006 01:37 PM

Port (yes, whine) Issue
 
Quote:

Tyrone Slothrop
No.
No, of course not.

Hypocrite.

Tyrone Slothrop 02-22-2006 01:42 PM

Port (yes, whine) Issue
 
Quote:

Originally posted by SlaveNoMore
No, of course not.

Hypocrite.
I'll "admit" that liberals are hypocritically exploiting an issue with a national-security angle to beat up on an unpopular president in an election year, and I gather you admit that the Republicans who were backing the president on the wiretapping thing were selling out the Constitution.

I'm not sure why it's an "admission" coming from me, since I was the first person on this board to back the President, but whatever.

Sidd Finch 02-22-2006 01:45 PM

Port (not wine) Issue
 
Quote:

Originally posted by Tyrone Slothrop
As a matter of procedure, you appear to have caught something that Drezner missed. As a matter of substance, if people from Defense, State, Commerce (whatever), Transportation, and other agencies looked at this and were satisfied, then what's the problem?

Because maybe a 45-day investigation might reveal some information that they didn't have when they decided they were satisfied? It's not a procedural waiting period -- it's a substantive investigation.

And also because I trust the executive branch of the federal gov't a little less than you do these days, particularly when they ignore "procedure" and then claim it's not really that important.

Sidd Finch 02-22-2006 01:47 PM

Port (not wine) Issue
 
Quote:

Originally posted by sebastian_dangerfield
Have you researched how many buildings and businesses the Saudis own here? The Saudis own a huge cunk of Citigroup.
And Apple, too. Yet I'm less worried about finding bombs in my iPod or my credit card statement than about finding them in one of the zillion containers coming into the ports of NYC.

This leaves aside the obvious distinction between "the Saudis" owning a huge "cunk" of a corporation's stock and the gov't of Dubai actually controlling a company.

Tyrone Slothrop 02-22-2006 01:48 PM

Port (not wine) Issue
 
Quote:

Originally posted by Sidd Finch
I trust the executive branch of the federal gov't a little less than you do these days, particularly when they ignore "procedure" and then claim it's not really that important.
I don't have an awful lot of confidence in the security of our ports, but I also don't think the sale of P&O will make that much difference on the margin.

Sidd Finch 02-22-2006 01:50 PM

Port (yes, whine) Issue
 
Quote:

Originally posted by Tyrone Slothrop
I was the first person on this board to back the President, but whatever.

And I'm backing Frist. Weird day all around.

I don't see what's so revolutionary about suggesting that the administration ought to comply with the law.*




*man, I crack me up.

original Hank@judged.com 02-22-2006 01:56 PM

Port (yes, whine) Issue
 
Quote:

Originally posted by Tyrone Slothrop
No.

eta:

But thanks for asking.

And if it is, I don't really care about whether liberals (?) are being hypocritical here -- I care much more about the separation of powers and whether previously supine Republicans in the House and Senate are going to let Bush get away with announcing that he can violate the law if he asserts a national-security angle.
The liberals are consistently anti-Bush per talking points directives at du. Isnt that the memo Ty?

Tyrone Slothrop 02-22-2006 01:58 PM

Port (yes, whine) Issue
 
Quote:

Originally posted by original Hank@judged.com
The liberals are consistently anti-Bush per talking points directives at du. Isnt that the memo Ty?
Would someone explain this sock to me? If there's a joke, it's lost on me.

Tyrone Slothrop 02-22-2006 02:00 PM

Port (yes, whine) Issue
 
Quote:

Originally posted by Sidd Finch
And I'm backing Frist. Weird day all around.

I don't see what's so revolutionary about suggesting that the administration ought to comply with the law.*


*man, I crack me up.
I have a hard time imagining what's going to come up in the further investigation (DoD: "Oh, you mean that government of the United Arab Emirates!"), but I'm all for it if it presents continued political trouble for Bush.


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