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-   -   Politics: Where we struggle to kneel in the muck. (http://www.lawtalkers.com/forums/showthread.php?t=630)

bilmore 09-23-2004 09:02 PM

Liberals want to ban your Bible.
 
Quote:

Originally posted by Not Bob
Fillibuster a wingnut district judge nominee? She'd have to be a fricken Yankee fan for me to do that. Supreme Court, on the other hand...
Bush winning will be just fine. But, for these kinds of reasons, you guys had damn well better get some legislators in the win column. I can't believe the ads haven't started yet - "Okay, Kerry's toast, but HERE'S why you still need to get out and vote . . . "

bilmore 09-23-2004 09:06 PM

Liberals want to ban your Bible.
 
Quote:

Originally posted by Sidd Finch
Deal. Does that mean that all judges appointed by a Dem president will be put up for a vote by a Repub senate? Or is the "Clinton exception" still in effect?
If I remember correctly, all Clinton nominees who made it out of committee got a vote.

SlaveNoMore 09-23-2004 09:11 PM

AWOL
 
Quote:

bilmore
Cite to the fact that this election is dominated by the ABB faction?
Roger Simon seems to think that Kerry is quickly generating an equally large ABK base

link
  • By finally adopting the reactionary "Dean Line" (well, not finally, there's no such thing with him) on Iraq, Kerry has placed himself in the position of having to root against the forces of democracy in that country, at least until the November election. He must hope for continued slaughter, beheadings and the like from the rag-tag collection of homicidal sociopaths and paleo-misogynists - Baathist and Islamist - that constitute the "insurgents" in order to defeat Bush, so is acting accordingly. Barely was Allawi's speech out of the interim PM's mouth when Kerry informed us, in the opinion of one of the two major presidential candidates in the most powerful country on Earth, there would be no January election in Iraq. (From your lips to Zarqawi's burning ears, Senator.)

    Leaving aside whatever moral evaluation we could make of those remarks - that is, after all, a personal matter - what if Kerry wins using this rhetoric? What will he do when confronted with decisions to make on Iraq? Will he help them hold an election? If not, will he withdraw our troops? Will he defend the majority of Iraqis who favor democracy? He hasn't told the public - ours or theirs. I doubt he knows himself. But it could be worse, far worse, than what happened in Vietnam after we left.

    No, I take it back. I will make a moral evaluation. It's inescapable. One word: shameful.

If Kerry keeps making comments like this, this President could be the first since Reagan to win a majority vote.

bilmore 09-23-2004 09:11 PM

Correction
 
I earlier posted that a certain confluence of events showed deep Dem involvement with Rather's Rewrites.

Since then, a blogger says he misunderstood another. The timing was off. There is no such controversy.

But, it would have been fun. It could have been another week talking about everything but Kerry's positions.

Ah, well.

bilmore 09-23-2004 09:13 PM

AWOL
 
Quote:

Originally posted by SlaveNoMore
If Kerry keeps making comments like this, this President could be the first since Reagan to win a majority vote.
Earlier, I had Kerry at a 75% chance.

You objected.

You were right.

Tyrone Slothrop 09-23-2004 11:35 PM

"I agree, I'm not the expert on how the Iraqi people think, because I live in America where it's nice and safe and secure."

-- George W. Bush, September 23

SlaveNoMore 09-23-2004 11:42 PM

Quote:

Tyrone Slothrop
"I agree, I'm not the expert on how the Iraqi people think, because I live in America where it's nice and safe and secure."

-- George W. Bush, September 23
Yes, this all during a press conference where the media idiots were asking the President what the people of Iraq think - and Bush embarrassed all of them by pointing at Allawi and telling them to ask him, seeing he lives there and he's their PM.

Tyrone Slothrop 09-23-2004 11:43 PM

Caption Contest
 
http://www.taipeitimes.com/images/20...922184347.jpeg

SlaveNoMore 09-23-2004 11:47 PM

Caption Contest
 
Quote:

Originally posted by Tyrone Slothrop
http://www.taipeitimes.com/images/20...922184347.jpeg
"Shhhh. Now, now. Don't fret. Kerry isn't going to get a chance to get us all killed. We've got this election in the bag"

Shape Shifter 09-24-2004 12:02 AM

Caption Contest
 
Quote:

Originally posted by Tyrone Slothrop
http://www.taipeitimes.com/images/20...922184347.jpeg
"I love you too, Ms. Reno,"

Not Me 09-24-2004 01:21 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Tyrone Slothrop
"I agree, I'm not the expert on how the Iraqi people think, because I live in America where it's nice and safe and secure."

-- George W. Bush, September 23
Iraq= flypaper for terrorist. Those of us living in the US are safer because we invaded Iraq. No doubt about it.

taxwonk 09-24-2004 01:25 AM

Liberals want to ban your Bible.
 
Quote:

Originally posted by Gattigap
Neither did Congress. That's the magic of it.
And the really funny part is how few of them know they really can't.

Say_hello_for_me 09-24-2004 01:47 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Not Me
Iraq= flypaper for terrorist. Those of us living in the US are safer because we invaded Iraq. No doubt about it.
I'm beginning to think that its making Israelis safer with respect to Palestinians too. There were several reports this week of Palestinian-origin terrorists being killed in Iraq. Before anyone points this out though, I'll note that at least one was a Jordanian of Palestinian origin.

Not Me 09-24-2004 02:27 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Say_hello_for_me
I'm beginning to think that its making Israelis safer with respect to Palestinians too. There were several reports this week of Palestinian-origin terrorists being killed in Iraq. Before anyone points this out though, I'll note that at least one was a Jordanian of Palestinian origin.
That wall separating Israel from the terrorist breeding grounds is helping, too.

ilikenewsocks 09-24-2004 10:23 AM

Caption Contest
 
Quote:

Originally posted by Tyrone Slothrop
http://www.taipeitimes.com/images/20...922184347.jpeg
You know, if you'd just ditch the sarong, grow your hair out a bit and start hanging out at Dead tribute band shows, you'd be a damn fine spinning hippie chick.

dtb 09-24-2004 10:42 AM

Liberals want to ban your Bible.
 
Quote:

Originally posted by SlaveNoMore
The niceties of "Peace Train" aside, when you refer to him as Yusef Islam and look at the anti-West comments he's made over the years (and his verbal support of the fatwah for the death of Salman Rushdie), it makes perfect sense to me.
Why is no one mentioning the fact that the dude got on the plane?!? Sure, they sent him to Maine instead of DC, but it doesn't inspire a lot of confidence that they get hip to his presence while the plane is over the Atlantic.

I'm not saying I think Yusef/Cat is a terrorist (in fact, I think that's laughable), but that someone on the "watch list", or whatever they call it, could merrily board the plane without incident is not overly comforting.


ETA: Cite please, for the statement that YS/CS verbally supported the fatwah against Salman Rushdie. As far as I can tell, that is horse poo. (I think the guy's a kook, but sue me, I liked his songs when he was Cat Stevens. I do not own any Cat Stevens records because of his "activities" -- but I will cop to owning tapes made from a friend's pre-conversion record -- yes, vinyl -- collection.)

Mmmm, Burger (C.J.) 09-24-2004 10:59 AM

Liberals want to ban your Bible.
 
Quote:

Originally posted by dtb
.


ETA: Cite please, for the statement that YS/CS verbally supported the fatwah against Salman Rushdie. As far as I can tell, that is horse poo.
He stated that Rushdie had committed blasphemy and that under Islamic law for that he should die. He later explained that he was merely stating the legal principle, not advocating it. But the initial quote certainly didn't sound like a dispassionate analysis (it was replayed on ABC News last night--maybe their website has it)

Google yusuf islam rushdie for various accounts.

sgtclub 09-24-2004 11:41 AM

Liberals want to ban your Bible.
 
Quote:

Originally posted by Replaced_Texan
The House did. Here's hoping for rationality in the Senate. Of course the Senate may also want to "protect an affirmation of religion that is part of the national heritage."
Joe Scarborough had an op-ed in the WSJ yesterday, laying out how disappointed he is with what the Republican Revolution has become. I agree. This is ridiculous. Bring back Newt..

sebastian_dangerfield 09-24-2004 11:52 AM

Liberals want to ban your Bible.
 
Quote:

Originally posted by SlaveNoMore
Am I deriving comfort from this tactic?

Personally, I think that anyone who refuses to recite the Pledge should be either jailed or deported.
Pledge affirmation, flag-burning bans... can there be any greater pile of rubbish for those jakasses in DC to jerk each other off about? I've recited the pledge about 1000 times and I have a huge flag waving from my house. If you refused to recite the pledge or wiped your ass with the flag, I wouldn't bad a fucking eyelash. Adherence to protocols of pomp and circumstance and reverence for symbols is a topic for idiots to debate.

sebastian_dangerfield 09-24-2004 12:10 PM

Liberals want to ban your Bible.
 
Quote:

Originally posted by dtb
Why is no one mentioning the fact that the dude got on the plane?!? Sure, they sent him to Maine instead of DC, but it doesn't inspire a lot of confidence that they get hip to his presence while the plane is over the Atlantic.

I'm not saying I think Yusef/Cat is a terrorist (in fact, I think that's laughable), but that someone on the "watch list", or whatever they call it, could merrily board the plane without incident is not overly comforting.


ETA: Cite please, for the statement that YS/CS verbally supported the fatwah against Salman Rushdie. As far as I can tell, that is horse poo. (I think the guy's a kook, but sue me, I liked his songs when he was Cat Stevens. I do not own any Cat Stevens records because of his "activities" -- but I will cop to owning tapes made from a friend's pre-conversion record -- yes, vinyl -- collection.)
We diverted a 747 to Maine because of Cat Stevens. I repeat... nah, on second thought, once is enough.

"Cheney, Cheney what have we done? What happened to the post war dream?"

Governance by jackasses for jackasses.

SlaveNoMore 09-24-2004 12:13 PM

Liberals want to ban your Bible.
 
Quote:

sgtclub
Joe Scarborough had an op-ed in the WSJ yesterday, laying out how disappointed he is with what the Republican Revolution has become. I agree. This is ridiculous. Bring back Newt..
If you've watched Scarborough Country lately, you'll note he's moved far to the left from his Rep days. Too many celebrity interviews and too much hanging with Reagan's prodgial son.

sebastian_dangerfield 09-24-2004 12:17 PM

Caption Contest
 
Quote:

Originally posted by Tyrone Slothrop
http://www.taipeitimes.com/images/20...922184347.jpeg
"That's a hell of a chub you've got. I'm going to work that thing raw. Room 443 - seven sharp. Whisper 'Crawford Steamer' to the man in sunglasses at the door."

"Thank you, Mr. President. I'm glad you like my junk."

Say_hello_for_me 09-24-2004 12:17 PM

Liberals want to ban your Bible.
 
Quote:

Originally posted by sebastian_dangerfield
Pledge affirmation, flag-burning bans... can there be any greater pile of rubbish for those jakasses in DC to jerk each other off about? I've recited the pledge about 1000 times and I have a huge flag waving from my house. If you refused to recite the pledge or wiped your ass with the flag, I wouldn't bad a fucking eyelash. Adherence to protocols of pomp and circumstance and reverence for symbols is a topic for idiots to debate.
I personally don't get offended by the symbolism, except in the following circumstance:

Someone publicly burns a flag in front of a veteran who cares (if I knew this for certain), I'm going to do one of two things:

1.) stand by and laugh as the veteran and anyone else who cares kicks his ass; or

2.) if I see someone I personally know, and personally know to be a veteran, getting agitated by said flag burning, I'll join in the ass-kicking.

Aside from San Francisco, I'm not sure any police officer in the country would care to intervene.

Note: what you do in the privacy of your backyard or whatever is none of my business.

Also note: cities that prohibit burning things outdoors (e.g., Chicago) should strictly and evenly enforce the prohibition on people who burn flags.

Like you are saying though, there is no need for Congress to get involved. This is a giant circle jerk in an election year.

Hello

sebastian_dangerfield 09-24-2004 12:23 PM

Liberals want to ban your Bible.
 
Quote:

Originally posted by sgtclub
Bring back Newt..
Agreed. Newt - call him what you will - was smarter than 90% of the imbeciles ruining the GOP at the moment. He paid lip service to the social conservatives, but obviously from the both his lifestyle and his post-public sector commentary, he's really only interested in fiscal issues. Unfortunately, he'd never rise to power in the present environment - he's too fucking intellectual and could be easily pegged a Rockefeller Republican (or "moral relativist"). That's a scary scenario - Newt Gingrich is now too left for the GOP.

I can't wait for the backlash in the midterm elections.

dtb 09-24-2004 12:31 PM

Liberals want to ban your Bible.
 
Quote:

Originally posted by Mmmm, Burger (C.J.)
He stated that Rushdie had committed blasphemy and that under Islamic law for that he should die. He later explained that he was merely stating the legal principle, not advocating it. But the initial quote certainly didn't sound like a dispassionate analysis (it was replayed on ABC News last night--maybe their website has it)

Google yusuf islam rushdie for various accounts.
Correct. I don't think you'll find many "terrorists" who are shy about standing behind and advocating the "he should die" principle. Probably not the most politic thing for good 'ol Yusef to have said, but the true fanatics, uh, I mean "believers", would never disavow the principle that he should (and, what's more, each one of them would happily volunteer to make him) die.

sebastian_dangerfield 09-24-2004 12:51 PM

Liberals want to ban your Bible.
 
Quote:

Originally posted by Say_hello_for_me
I personally don't get offended by the symbolism, except in the following circumstance:

Someone publicly burns a flag in front of a veteran who cares (if I knew this for certain), I'm going to do one of two things:

1.) stand by and laugh as the veteran and anyone else who cares kicks his ass; or

2.) if I see someone I personally know, and personally know to be a veteran, getting agitated by said flag burning, I'll join in the ass-kicking.

Aside from San Francisco, I'm not sure any police officer in the country would care to intervene.

Note: what you do in the privacy of your backyard or whatever is none of my business.

Also note: cities that prohibit burning things outdoors (e.g., Chicago) should strictly and evenly enforce the prohibition on people who burn flags.

Like you are saying though, there is no need for Congress to get involved. This is a giant circle jerk in an election year.

Hello
I had a massive flag in my place in college. It took up a whole wall. I'm a huge fan of Rick Rubin's work as a producer, so I own a lot of American Recordings discs. American Recordings' symbol has been an inverted flag for a long time. I thought it looked cool, so I inverted the flag on our wall. Some waterhead from the baseball team gave me a rash of shit once in the midst of the horrible mushroom trip (idiot ate close to a whole 1/4) about the sanctity of the flag. It was one of the most amazingly incohrenet arguments I ever heard. He was totally freaked out and grasping for any "simple value" which would help him keep his grasp. I advised him the only thing that could save him was a heavy does of whiskey, which advice he wisely took. Once he calmed down and got over the first wave, he was a pleasant fellow. I kind of feel he represents most people who have hard-ons for "symbols" and speak of certain values as "sacred." They want, er, need, to believe in something really badly, or have been trained like dobermans to believe in certain "sacred" things. But if you can punch through the layer of dogma that shields their brain like a malignant meniscus, they suddenly realize just how silly their adherence to these middle class values really are. The pillars fall and they suddenly think "Fuck, why the hell am I going nuts over some idiot burning a flag?"

I'm patriotic as hell. I'd volunteer to torture Queda folks and I still get misty passing the Trade Centers. But I'm also likely to wipe my ass with the flag in front of anyone who spins some horseshit about pledges and the sanctity of any symbol. Folks of that mindset need a swift jolt to the side of the head, just like folks who actually burn flags deserve to be laughed at for being equally stupid.

Shape Shifter 09-24-2004 01:06 PM

Liberals want to ban your Bible.
 
Quote:

Originally posted by sebastian_dangerfield
I had a massive flag in my place in college. It took up a whole wall. I'm a huge fan of Rick Rubin's work as a producer, so I own a lot of American Recordings discs. American Recordings' symbol has been an inverted flag for a long time. I thought it looked cool, so I inverted the flag on our wall. Some waterhead from the baseball team gave me a rash of shit once in the midst of the horrible mushroom trip (idiot ate close to a whole 1/4) about the sanctity of the flag. It was one of the most amazingly incohrenet arguments I ever heard. He was totally freaked out and grasping for any "simple value" which would help him keep his grasp. I advised him the only thing that could save him was a heavy does of whiskey, which advice he wisely took. Once he calmed down and got over the first wave, he was a pleasant fellow. I kind of feel he represents most people who have hard-ons for "symbols" and speak of certain values as "sacred." They want, er, need, to believe in something really badly, or have been trained like dobermans to believe in certain "sacred" things. But if you can punch through the layer of dogma that shields their brain like a malignant meniscus, they suddenly realize just how silly their adherence to these middle class values really are. The pillars fall and they suddenly think "Fuck, why the hell am I going nuts over some idiot burning a flag?"

I'm patriotic as hell. I'd volunteer to torture Queda folks and I still get misty passing the Trade Centers. But I'm also likely to wipe my ass with the flag in front of anyone who spins some horseshit about pledges and the sanctity of any symbol. Folks of that mindset need a swift jolt to the side of the head, just like folks who actually burn flags deserve to be laughed at for being equally stupid.
If we could only get everyone to do shrooms and whiskey in Sebby's dorm room, the world would be a better place. Especially for Hello, who could conveniently execute all of them on the way out.

sgtclub 09-24-2004 01:23 PM

Airplane Report
 
Was on a plane yesterday. Fully packed. I think the airlines are trying to save money by not turning on the air until after takeoff. In any event it was hot and stuffy and wouldn't you know, I get stuck next to a fatty, which made the situation that much more intolerable. I'm still fuming this morning.

Say_hello_for_me 09-24-2004 01:39 PM

Liberals want to ban your Bible.
 
Quote:

Originally posted by Shape Shifter
If we could only get everyone to do shrooms and whiskey in Sebby's dorm room, the world would be a better place. Especially for Hello, who could conveniently execute all of them on the way out.
But if everyone was doing it, it would be legal wouldn't it?

1) Legalize or
2) Shoot everybody involved.

No difference to me, just don't tax me and use it to unfairly imprison our poor minorities.

Shape Shifter 09-24-2004 01:46 PM

Liberals want to ban your Bible.
 
Quote:

Originally posted by Say_hello_for_me
But if everyone was doing it, it would be legal wouldn't it?
Everyone drives about 90 mph on I-10 between Houston and San Antonio. Doesn't make it legal.

Tyrone Slothrop 09-24-2004 01:48 PM

Liberals want to ban your Bible.
 
Quote:

Originally posted by Mmmm, Burger (C.J.)
He stated that Rushdie had committed blasphemy and that under Islamic law for that he should die. He later explained that he was merely stating the legal principle, not advocating it. But the initial quote certainly didn't sound like a dispassionate analysis (it was replayed on ABC News last night--maybe their website has it)

Google yusuf islam rushdie for various accounts.
If (if) Cat Stevens is a terrorist and should be excluded from the country for opining that Salman Rushdie should be killed for blaspheming, what does that mean that Oklahoma Senate candidate Dr. Tom Cobourn, who opines that doctors who perform (legal) abortions should be killed?

Tyrone Slothrop 09-24-2004 01:49 PM

Liberals want to ban your Bible.
 
Quote:

Originally posted by sgtclub
Joe Scarborough had an op-ed in the WSJ yesterday, laying out how disappointed he is with what the Republican Revolution has become. I agree. This is ridiculous. Bring back Newt..
Politicians respond to votes more than to pious sentiments. If you want them to cut it out, you have to vote against them.

Shape Shifter 09-24-2004 01:49 PM

Liberals want to ban your Bible.
 
Quote:

Originally posted by dtb
Why is no one mentioning the fact that the dude got on the plane?!? Sure, they sent him to Maine instead of DC, but it doesn't inspire a lot of confidence that they get hip to his presence while the plane is over the Atlantic.
I've got to wonder how the folks in Maine feel about this. "Hey, this guy could blow something up. Let's send him to Bangor."

Shape Shifter 09-24-2004 01:50 PM

Liberals want to ban your Bible.
 
Quote:

Originally posted by Tyrone Slothrop
If (if) Cat Stevens is a terrorist and should be excluded from the country for opining that Salman Rushdie should be killed for blaspheming, what does that mean that Oklahoma Senate candidate Dr. Tom Cobourn, who opines that doctors who perform (legal) abortions should be killed?
He should be sent to Maine.

ilikenewsocks 09-24-2004 01:50 PM

Liberals want to ban your Bible.
 
Quote:

Originally posted by Shape Shifter
Everyone drives about 90 mph on I-10 between Houston and San Antonio. Doesn't make it legal.
But it does make one hell of a political statement, doesn't it? Kind of like the teenagers who picketed a suburban Detroit Chuck-E-Cheese b/c they couldn't get in to play videogames without an adult.

ETA link

Sidd Finch 09-24-2004 01:55 PM

Liberals want to ban your Bible.
 
Quote:

Originally posted by Tyrone Slothrop
If (if) Cat Stevens is a terrorist and should be excluded from the country for opining that Salman Rushdie should be killed for blaspheming, what does that mean that Oklahoma Senate candidate Dr. Tom Cobourn, who opines that doctors who perform (legal) abortions should be killed?

I'm trying not to follow the Cat Stevens story because he generally depresses me -- fucking waste of talent. But I thought he was put on a watchlist because of his donations to certain Islamic "charities", not what he said about the fatwa against Rushdie No?

If Tom Cobourn gave money that was funneled to people who bomb abortion clinics, deporting him would be fine with me. Hell, he and Cat probably take a lot of the same positions.

sebastian_dangerfield 09-24-2004 01:55 PM

Liberals want to ban your Bible.
 
Quote:

Originally posted by Say_hello_for_me
But if everyone was doing it, it would be legal wouldn't it?

1) Legalize or
2) Shoot everybody involved.

No difference to me, just don't tax me and use it to unfairly imprison our poor minorities.
Read this month's National Review article in which Ethan Nadelman absolutely filets some jackass brueaucrat in charge of drug policy. Its a real work of art. Its also worth reading NR's article in favor of pot legalization a few months back. Very well reasoned.

Why is it in 2004 we're still refusing to acknowledge what both Nixon and Carter's people admitted - harmless drugs (rread, not coke and heroin) should be legal. The Nixon drug report recommending decriminalization is still being deep sixed by the GOP, as though it never existed.

Sidd Finch 09-24-2004 01:57 PM

Liberals want to ban your Bible.
 
Quote:

Originally posted by sebastian_dangerfield
Why is it in 2004 we're still refusing to acknowledge what both Nixon and Carter's people admitted - harmless drugs (rread, not coke and heroin) should be legal. The Nixon drug report recommending decriminalization is still being deep sixed by the GOP, as though it never existed.

Because marijuana is not harmless. It's a gateway drug, and it leads to massive overeating that can really screw up your diet program, which is the last thing this obese nation needs.

(Screw Atkins, gimme the chips! I got munchies!!!)

SlaveNoMore 09-24-2004 02:05 PM

Liberals want to ban your Bible.
 
Quote:

sebastian_dangerfield
I thought it looked cool, so I inverted the flag on our wall.
You should have been beaten to a pulp.

SlaveNoMore 09-24-2004 02:10 PM

Liberals want to ban your Bible.
 
Quote:

Sidd Finch
If Tom Cobourn gave money that was funneled to people who bomb abortion clinics, deporting him would be fine with me. Hell, he and Cat probably take a lot of the same positions.
2


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