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Originally posted by Secret_Agent_Man
You've been talking a lot of shit for the last few weeks -- some of it on things you know about, and some obviously not. I'll call you on this one. Kerry said precisely those words (essentially a quote) during both of the Presidential debates. I also think they are more or less in one of his stump speeches.
You're just not listening.
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I'll be serious with you.
At best, if he said something like "We are at war, and its going to be a long war that will force us to confront many enemies in many countries for the foreseeable future", its contrary to numerous statements and positions of his over the last 3 years.
In any case, if you believe he will treat this like a war, and I'm being serious here, please let me know what the "Kerry doctrine" is. Can we go into other countries? Assassinations? Preemption? Invasions? If I don't hear him reiterate the Bush doctrine (Big War, Preemption), than I don't see how we are better off with him. Of course, if we do hear him reiterate it, it will be ironic that he's essentially adopting the "neocon" ideal. Which would be okay, right-idea wrong-people implementing it, except that he's derided it so often.
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Originally posted by Secret_Agent_Man
It is remarkable to me that you find it so easy to believe this of a man who: volunteered for the military, saw combat, was decorated for courage under fire, served as a prosecutor, immersed himself in public service and (before that) engaged in public discourse and activism on the most important issues of that time. Kerry has proven beyond a doubt, over the course of his life, that he thinks seriously and cares deeply about the critical issues of the day. No one could have said that about Bush before he became President.
Of course you need to look at a man's record, but it is also a mistake NOT to think that the Presidency is a unique office and the demands and responsibilities of the job can change their occupants to produce results one would not expect from their records. The job of a President (i.e. represent and protect the nation) is different than the job of any Senator or representative and requires one to view problems differently and take broader positions.
In other words, whatever Kerry has done as 1 of 100 Senators from 1984-2004 (and we disagree on that record) is not an indication that he will not take appropriate action as President in a world tranformed by the 9/11 attacks and the ensuing wars.
Consider, for example, that Harry Truman was a relatively undistinguished Senator with little record before Roosevelt picked him as VP.
If you think that Bush has done well, then your man is also a prime example. Ignore everything pre-1980, and you still have this record: started three businesses with money borrowed from family connections and ran them into the ground; leveraged the cash from the last into an ownership stake in the Texas Rangers (his partners always wanted the Bush name); became personally wealthy based on insider dealings, despite conflicts of interest, with the stadium land deal; served six years in, essentially, a part-time job as Governor of Texas where he laughed about the executions he oversaw. What in the world would make anyone think that this "record" is suitable to be President of the U.S. during and after 9/11?
S_A_M
etft and efs and to add "NOT"
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Believe me, I'm voting for Bush only as a comparative matter. I simply do not see Kerry a.) fighting this war to a successful conclusion and b.) doing anything right, er, Right, economically.
But all-in-all, like I think just about everyone else here feels, I think the whole idea of having to choose between these two mutts is a travesty.
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Kerry has proven beyond a doubt, over the course of his life, that he thinks seriously and cares deeply about the critical issues of the day. No one could have said that about Bush before he became President.
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Just to address this again, I basically agree with this. Fortunately, I think we turned out okay with Bush in terms of ideology when the right ideology was needed in one particular area (our security). While Kerry may think seriously and care deeply, he simply does not come out with the right answers. I don't know why that is. But I don't know why he didn't know he was Jewish until just before he was running for President in a party that historically received a grossly disproportionate amount of its funding from Jews.
If it helps anyone to avoid seeing red, I am sorta Jewish.
