Politics: J'accuse!

[Tyrone Slothrop]

Originally posted by bilmore
Hey, Ty, wanna reconsider that PC crack?

No. Regret getting involved now?

[Not Bob]

Dennis Kucinich criticized John Kerry on NPR this morning (Kerry "needs to take a position on getting out of NAFTA" etc.)

Just off the top of my head ....

Sam Nunn ---> Bill Clinton*

Tip O'Neill ---> Jimmy Carter

Bob Kerrey ---> Bill Clinton*

Ted Kennedy ---> Jimmy Carter (prior to and after primary challenge)

Jimmy Carter ---> Ted Kennedy ("I'll whip his ass" -- doesn't count since it was in the 1980 primary context, but I like the line from the Baptist Sunday school teacher)

Ted Kennedy ---> Bill Clinton*

The two most recent Democratic presidents were remarkably unpopular in Congress. Carter pissed off O'Neill and the other Democratic barons by his holier-than-thou attitude, his refusal to consult with them on legislation, and his attacks on pork (especially on highway bills). Read O'Neill's memoirs or Carter's memoirs for details.

Clinton also had problems with Democrats in the house and senate. Bob Kerrey called him weak on defense, and predicted that George the Elder would "peel him like a boiled peanut." Sam Nunn did the same, if not with such delightful imagery. Democratic leaders in the House blamed him and Hillary (and Ira Magaziner, I suppose) for health care fiasco which they contend led to the loss of their majority in 1994. I bet that Newt's book (To Renew America, or something like that) about that election probably has a quote or two, but Bob Woodward's book definitely does.

And don't even get me started on the Gold Democrats versus the Free Silver Democrats.


*pre-Monica. Post-Monica, every Democrat -- other than Buddy the dog -- criticized him.

[sgtclub]

Originally posted by Gattigap
In what will be a startling turn of events to Club and pro-growth GOPers and Libertarians everywhere, the Christian Science Monitor tells us that the economy has done better under Democratic presidents than Republican ones since the 1940s.

Measured by GDP, by the stock market, by unemployment statistics. All Democratic.

Time to finally give in, Club. Like I've mentioned before, meetings are at 9:30, though a recent rule change is that newbies have to bring the coffee. Last I remember,

* Sidd drinks hi-test
* Ty is partial to venti chai latte no-foam
* Atticus will drink anything, but requires "fair trade" coffee only. (Good luck with that.)
* I'll go with the half double decaffeinated half-caf, with a twist of lemon
* SAM calls in from a remote location, so you're safe there

The others, you'll have to ask.

-- Gattigap

Indeed surprising. I wonder what the real amount per family is under DEMS (i.e., how much of the up do we get to keep under the DEMS?)

[SlaveNoMore]

Not Bob
Tip O'Neill ---> Jimmy Carter

Ted Kennedy ---> Jimmy Carter (prior to and after primary challenge)

Jimmy Carter ---> Ted Kennedy ("I'll whip his ass" -- doesn't count since it was in the 1980 primary context, but I like the line from the Baptist Sunday school teacher)

Tip O'Neill? Carter?

You know, if you look hard enough, I'm sure you can find a few negative quotes from Huey Long about FDR and from WJ Bryan about Grover Cleveland.

[Not Me]

Originally posted by sgtclub
Indeed surprising. I wonder what the real amount per family is under DEMS (i.e., how much of the up do we get to keep under the DEMS?)

Hi, I don't know nothin' 'bout no economics, but I like my tea with milk and honey.

[sgtclub]

Originally posted by The Larry Davis Experience
I have seen Scarborough on Matthews' show a few times differing from the party line. Not in any strenuous way, but he does seem to be more of an objective thinker than the other talk show hosts that I instinctively lump him in with. But maybe that's just because someone else was asking him the questions. I have never seen his own show, despite the fact that I love the self-importance of the show's title.

I wish we Dems had someone as open minded as Joe, so we could somehow combat this "we're better than you guys because you guys don't disagree with the party line" theme being advanced by the admin supporters on the Board. Damn our hidebound message discipline! Damn it to hell!

edited to insert Joe's last name

Joe is a stickler for balanced budgets. He was part of the 1994 class and is thoroughly pissed off at the current congress.

[Atticus Grinch]

Originally posted by bilmore
I feel woefully inadequate here. I can recognize the sarcasm, simply by tone, but, other than that, have no clue what you're saying.

You need to route your kayaking trips on rivers with better WiFi access. I can't believe you missed the only dumb* thing Slave has ever said.

*N.B. "Dumb" is a small subset of "Wrong." Slave has said many, many Wrong things in his career.

[Not Me]

Originally posted by Not Me
Hi, I don't know nothin' 'bout no economics, but I like my tea with milk and honey.

FYI - this wasn't commentary on anyone having won or lost a debate. I just want everyone to know what I drink. Drinking coffee is so gauche. Tea with milk and honey is where it is at.

[SlaveNoMore]

Atticus Grinch
Slave has said many, many Wrong things in his career.

Catrin_Darcy
2

[ltl/fb]

Originally posted by SlaveNoMore
Tip O'Neill? Carter?

You know, if you look hard enough, I'm sure you can find a few negative quotes from Huey Long about FDR and from WJ Bryan about Grover Cleveland.

Sweet pea, if we are looking for Dem criticisms of Dem presidents, and Dem criticisms of Clinton are going to be disregarded either because of Monica or, I dunno, because he's from Ark "thank god for Mississippi" ansas, what president do you want people to look at?

You realize that implying that Carter is from the pre-electricity era also implies that you are very, very old, grandpa.

[Not Bob]

Originally posted by SlaveNoMore
Tip O'Neill? Carter?

Are you saying that (a) they didn't dislike each other and make it well known with mutual criticism, or (b) that it occurred in the Dark Ages, and is therefore Not Relevant? If (b), what can I say? I'm old. Plus, the challenge (I think) was to find presidential-related criticism. Thanks to the campaigns of Carter II, Fritz, and Mike "Mister Personality" Dukakis, that doesn't leave me with many options.

Originally posted by SlaveNoMore
You know, if you look hard enough, I'm sure you can find a few negative quotes from Huey Long about FDR and from WJ Bryan about Grover Cleveland.

Hell, you don't even have to look hard, which is why I said:

And don't even get me started on the Gold Democrats versus the Free Silver Democrats.

Or maybe Aaron Burr and Thomas Jefferson, for that matter.

[Mmmm, Burger (C.J.)]

I know Ty doesn't care, but for anyone who does, Scalia has apologized for the tape erasure business

http://biz.yahoo.com/law/040413/88db...134f295_1.html

1) Changed policy to allow print media to record for purposes of accurate recording

2) Maintains ban on broadcast media taping

3) Explains he did not direct marshall to seize/erase tapes.

[sgtclub]

Originally posted by Not Me
FYI - this wasn't commentary on anyone having won or lost a debate. I just want everyone to know what I drink. Drinking coffee is so gauche. Tea with milk and honey is where it is at.

are you english?

[Tyrone Slothrop]

Originally posted by Mmmm, Burger (C.J.)
I know Ty doesn't care, but for anyone who does, Scalia has apologized for the tape erasure business

http://biz.yahoo.com/law/040413/88db...134f295_1.html

1) Changed policy to allow print media to record for purposes of accurate recording

2) Maintains ban on broadcast media taping

3) Explains he did not direct marshall to seize/erase tapes.

I do care. Deeply. I'm also curious to see how long it takes Not Me to slap you around for not stping.

Dahlia Lithwick has a piece over on Slate observing that the marshals often act arbitrarily -- her experience is with covering the Court -- for the reason that they answer to no one except the justices, who surely have better things to do than supervise them.

[Sidd Finch]

[[never mind]]