New Fashion Board 10-3-2003 - 11-7-2003

[ltl/fb]

Originally posted by Say_hello_for_me
Sweetie, I don't know how to tell you this, but I lost you in a poker game last night. Have you met my friend Mr. Petch? You know, my friend from law school?


Gus Petch?

Gus Petch, Ass-Nailer at Law?

Something tells me that he'll be a lot more affectionate than I was.

You have the ownership direction backwards. And I was talking about Shape Shifter, with whom I want to go on semiannual Carribean vacations. He's snaky.

[mmm3587]

Originally posted by ThurgreedMarshall
Your problem is that you speak in extremes. "If you don't like yourself, even if you can make you like yourself more for a while with some breast implants, that's not going to make yourself like you in the long run." If you're speaking to the problem of insecurity and self hate, then the people who have plastic surgery to try to fix that are never going to be happy. No argument there. But it does not follow that someone who has plastic surgery necessarily has these problems.

And here's your real problem. You're talking to the wrong people. Strippers don't represent the general population as far as mental health goes. The insecurity problems they have are surely more pronounced. Not only that, but I think you will find that the "viewing their breasts as a reason for men to be attracted to them and a reason for men to treat them a certain way," attitude among strippers is somewhat (okay, very) related to their profession. So if you want to revise your post so that you're talking about the image problems of strippers with implants, I'll probably agree with most of what you say. Unfortunately, you can't make this big a shift in the middle of an argument without a few people catching it.

TM

I never said that all the women I know who have gotten breast implants are strippers (most are not) or that getting breast implants was the same as being a stripper or a prostitute (I don't think that it is).

I've also never suggested that all women who get breast implants or other forms of elective plastic surgery often obtained not to correct what many people would consider to be faults (like a strange looking nose or excessive facial wrinkles, or whatever) exhibit the kind of feelings I've talked about.

What I have said, repeatedly, is this: in my experience (which is talking to people I know, observing and hearing the talk about people I don't and reading) women who get breast implants often get them because of unhealthy feelings about themselves, objectification and their bad relationships with men. That's all I'm fucking saying. Your repeated attempts to create straw men you find despicable, reprehensible (there's my straw man!) or whatever are misplaced.

What I initially said, and what I still believe, is that the reasons women get breast implants are often the same reasons women become strippers or prostitutes. That is, unhealthy feelings about themselves, objectification and their bad relatrionships with me.


A few have defended me, but most haven't even listened to what I said. Did you even read it (probably not, as it was far too long, admittedly)? Or did you just see breast implant and stripper in the same sentence and imagine that I said something that I did not.

[ltl/fb]

Originally posted by Aloha Mr. Learned Hand
Wow, Shifter. They're fighting over you.

Must be that whole "V", hump the alien lizard thing that I was reminded of by "I Love the 80's Strikes Back" the other night...

Either that, or it's the footlong tongue thing...

I think I must really have multiple personalities and not know it (well, this personality doesn't know). At the same time, each personality has on some subconscious level an understanding of what the other personalities have done. Because I never watch V and I never read the Bell Jar but apparently I am acting them out. Or something.

[ThurgreedMarshall]

Originally posted by paigowprincess
I have to go with the little colored post it flag thingies.

That would be, "post-its of color."

TM

Originally posted by Tyrone_Slothrop
Bitch, please: You're a day early.

I LOLED thinking that you mneant that Sebby woud be doing some mad wonking tomorrow. We hit all his favorites- fake tits and the strippery. low class prostitutes that get them, the dumpy american male, cocaine and the college gunner who did no drugs, ltl on fatness, etc. but then I realized you must be referring to flaming friday, which wasnt as funny.

[ltl/fb]

Originally posted by paigowprincess
I LOLED thinking that you mneant that Sebby woud be doing some mad wonking tomorrow. We hit all his favorites- fake tits and the strippery. low class prostitutes that get them, the dumpy american male, cocaine and the college gunner who did no drugs, ltl on fatness, etc. but then I realized you must be referring to flaming friday, which wasnt as funny.

SHHHHHHHH. I've been thinking all the posting topics today are like saying Beetlejuice beetlejuice beetlejuice. Now SHUT UP.

[Tyrone Slothrop]

Originally posted by paigowprincess
I LOLED thinking that you mneant that Sebby woud be doing some mad wonking tomorrow. We hit all his favorites- fake tits and the strippery. low class prostitutes that get them, the dumpy american male, cocaine and the college gunner who did no drugs, ltl on fatness, etc. but then I realized you must be referring to flaming friday, which wasnt as funny.

No, you were right -- I meant the funnier thing.

[ThurgreedMarshall]

Originally posted by mmm3587
What I initially said, and what I still believe, is that the reasons women get breast implants are often the same reasons women become strippers or prostitutes. That is, unhealthy feelings about themselves, objectification and their bad relatrionships with me.

Well, that clears it all up for me, you maroon.

TM

[notcasesensitive]

Originally posted by Aloha Mr. Learned Hand
Wow, Shifter. They're fighting over you.

Must be that whole "V", hump the alien lizard thing that I was reminded of by "I Love the 80's Strikes Back" the other night...

Thanks for the reminder, Hand. I meant to reply to Atticus' earlier post about this show -- yes, Boy George actually scared me the first time I saw him. Also a wondered about why the big emphasis on movies during the 1983 episode (the only one I've seen so far). That was the year of the birth of Mtv and they have the people talking instead about all of these movies that I've never seen. Sheesh.


Confidential to Ty: Your timmy post about Burger's contradictions just about killed me. Good times.

[Bad_Rich_Chic]

Originally posted by purse junkie
BRC, I would normally defer to you in all matters of etiquette, but breakup-by-letter? Never, never put anything in writing that could come back to haunt you. A nice, neutral, friendly goodbye? "Look [as it's shown to all the dumpee's friends], em's a callous soulless emotionless bastard!" A gentle explanation of the reasons? "Look [as it's shown to all the dumpee's friends], like em's such a goddamn prize?[listing of all em's deeply embarrassing personal flaws to total strangers ensues]"

Give me the spine-cringing scene. At least it's over and there's no record afterwards.

That's why you keep the letter nice and neutral. The whole school of "Dear John" letter writing is designed specifically to protect the writer from any possible attack on character.

If I was looking to dump someone, having them show my letters to others would give me a most welcome excuse. A person who would show a lover's or former-lover's letters to any third party is pretty much the definition of a cad, and has indisputably justified the dumping.

But doing the scene in person is fine. Just don't give in to the requests for an explanation. Learn to just say "no, thank you" (or, in this case, "I'm so sorry I just can't"). (Unless you have a really unassailable reason, such as: "I am sure you understand that, having discovered that you have been carrying on with that Johanssen woman whilst you professed your undying love and fidelity to me, you have broken my heart and I can have nothing further to do with you, ever," or "I have discovered that you have shown so little care for the tenderness of my feelings towards you that you have shown my letters all about town. I entrusted the deepest secrets of my heart to you, and you treated it as a common amusement and have broken it. Knowing now that you consider my feelings worthless things I can have nothing further blah blah blah.")

Not having a written record has its advantages, though it is no more likely to be truly "over." You will still be subject to the post-mortem character assasination among friends ("listen to what she said" rather than "see what she wrote"), but by avoiding any explanations at all you avoid giving them the ammunition.

BR(I love melodramatic letter writting)C

edited for grammar but not spelling

[pony_trekker]

Originally posted by paigowprincess
I fucking hate them. Especially the little ones. More aggravating than an asshole driver who speeds up when heading towards a traffic light.

No. No. NO. Paper clips are good. They help me a lot, especially in resetting my stupid palm pilot.

The worst thing are the asshole stay-at-home soccer moms in my neighborhood who cannot figure out how to QUICKLY drop off their little trolls at school. They stop in the middle of the street then roll through a fucking stop sign. BEEP BEEP BEEP.

Proof that women should not be allowed to drive.

[ltl/fb]

Originally posted by pony_trekker
women should not be allowed to drive.

Terrorist. Only terrorist countries don't let women drive.

[Mmmm, Burger (C.J.)]

Originally posted by pony_trekker
They stop in the middle of the street then roll through a fucking stop sign. BEEP BEEP BEEP.

This differs from the average NYC cab driver how?

[dtb]

Originally posted by Bad_Rich_Chic
In any event, the way to break up with him is just to say "I've enjoyed our time together, but I'm afraid this just isn't going to work romantically. I hope we can still remain friends." Under no circumstances should she offer any explanation for why it won't work. (They always ask, and there is never an acceptable answer. Certainly not one that the dumped wants to hear. If you offer a non-crushing reason they tend to try to argue, requiring an escalation of reasons from the dumper, which leads only to regret on all parts.) She should just repeat "I'm sorry, I just can't," "I'm sorry, it just won't," and if pressed and desperate, "It's nothing you did, so there is nothing you can do about it," and, ultimately, "I'm afraid I just can't, and I can't discuss it with you further, there's nothing to say."

Just thought you might find amusing the response my friend wrote when I passed along your sage advice:

Originally e-mailed to dtb from her one friend
Very very interesting. Its a very good point that there is never an acceptable reason and true if pressed I may go on a rant of: firstly, its the damn exclamation marks, secondly the baby talk after romance; The ubiquitous email signoff of "Have a Nice Day!"; the fact you, a man, have a "H" (hermes) buckle belt and have worn it in my presence; you don't get my jokes; you pushed me about [calling in a favor to get you free] baseball tickets; you pretend to be a [child-rearing] expert to manipulate my feelings; Your wardrobe "never goes out of style" -- etc etc.

It's fairly dispositive evidence that it's over when someone's wardrobe starts to irritate you.

[Aloha Mr. Learned Hand]

Originally posted by notcasesensitive
Also a wondered about why the big emphasis on movies during the 1983 episode (the only one I've seen so far). That was the year of the birth of Mtv and they have the people talking instead about all of these movies that I've never seen. Sheesh.

MTV actually dates to 1981, but yeah Boy is looking pretty scary. Of the others, Juliette Lewis (as I think Atticus was alluding to) seems like a total ditz. Mo Rocca and Michael Ian Black are still great, though. The segments on Weird Science, Fraggle Rock and North and South were pretty funny.

"How can I root against the South? They've got Patrick Swayze!"

As always, my 2nd favorite Chicago female musician (Mmmm, Nekoooooo) Liz Phair is looking h-hot...