Politics As Usual

[Say_hello_for_me]

Originally posted by Secret_Agent_Man
I've tried to donate, but never got a response to my PM or e-mail. Paypal baffles me. Where do I send the cheese? [I'll just send a check or something, because I don't care.]

S_A_M

And from the right: What he said.

I pay bills throug paypal. Is there an easy and secure way to send money? I'll try it right after I post this.

Hello

Why? Because this board is a good portion of the free time I have now. Work is insane. Its so bad that I bought an Apple laptop just so I could watch movies occasionally. You know, from the table at the side of my desk when I'm reading the refrigerator-manual of the day. If I can afford that, I can afford this.

[Gattigap]

Originally posted by sgtclub
I've posted many articles on both WMDs and the connections, which you summarily dismiss. That's fine. Forget the articles. Every intelligence agency in the world thought they were there and they weren't basing the analysis on Chalabi. Where did they go? I have never heard a satisfactory answer to that question. I doubt they were destoyed, that just doesn't make sense. They are either still there or were moved.

Don't forget, we're talking about a period of close to 10 years where we really had shit for intelligence about what was going on in Iraq with WMDs. I've posted about this earlier, with some theories from people smarter than me about where the WMDs went, and the term "Syria!" doesn't even appear in them.

If one works under the assumption that up until a few months before the invasion that the intel about WMDs was correct, then yes, it's vastly unlikely that they were all destroyed overnight. Reexamining that assumption, though, permits more possibilities.

[Atticus Grinch]

Originally posted by Gattigap
If one works under the assumption that up until a few months before the invasion that the intel about WMDs was correct, then yes, it's vastly unlikely that they were all destroyed overnight. Reexamining that assumption, though, permits more possibilities.

Reexamining assumptions is for commies, atheists, and various other pussies. The word for the 21st century is resolve.

[SlaveNoMore]

Originally posted by Say_hello_for_me
And from the right: What he said.

I think there has been some miscommunication among the Admins here since Leagl's phaseout as to the PayPal account, etc.

We're working on it and I'll put something on the WELCOME board shortly. Thanks.

[And it's a good time too, since we running severely low on funds]

[SlaveNoMore]

Atticus Grinch
*EMPHASIS ADDED.

You know very well that I meant the Gorelick "Wall", the utter failings of the CIA, FBI, INS etc. and all the reams of faulty intelligence.

But I like the way you spinned me. Touche.

[Say_hello_for_me]

Originally posted by SlaveNoMore
I think there has been some miscommunication among the Admins here since Leagl's phaseout as to the PayPal account, etc.

We're working on it and I'll put something on the WELCOME board shortly. Thanks.

[And it's a good time too, since we running severely low on funds]

I just tried it. RT shows up as the donee (no problemo). Pressing the link probably only works if you already have a Paypal account. It allows you to sign in on the first screen while also specifying the amount. Mebbe I didn't have an account last time I tried.

Hello

[Tyrone Slothrop]

Originally posted by sgtclub
I've posted many articles on both WMDs and the connections, which you summarily dismiss. That's fine. Forget the articles. Every intelligence agency in the world thought they were there and they weren't basing the analysis on Chalabi. Where did they go? I have never heard a satisfactory answer to that question. I doubt they were destoyed, that just doesn't make sense. They are either still there or were moved.

You've posted articles on things like the mobile vans that were supposed to be WMD labs, but then they turned out to be for artillery spotting balloons. So I'm really not sure what evidence you think there is that's still good.

It turns out that Chalabi's group was feeding bogus intel to countries all over the world, which were sharing it with each other, but protecting their sources. So, yes, a lot of people were basing the analysis on Chalabi, as it turns out. I suspect you get a lot of your information from the circles where the neo-cons are popular, and so they may not be dwelling on these facts. If you really want me to find stories from mainstream media, I will.

And what Gattigap says. We had imperfect information about what was going on in Iraq. Everybody assumed it had chemical weapons because it used them in the 1980s, but they deteriorate over time, and now it appears that the sanctions may have worked, in the sense that Hussein didn't invest in keeping the programs going. It also appears that the nuclear and biological weapons programs were not what we feared.

Not only did we not have human assets there, as Gattigap says, it now appears that our technological intel wasn't as good as we thought. E.g.:

• U.S. experts, for example, still have not been able to determine the meaning of three secretly taped conversations that Secretary of State Colin L. Powell played to the United Nations Security Council in February 2003 in making the case for war. Investigators have been unable to identify who was speaking on the tapes or precisely what they were talking about.*
  
  U.S. analysts also erred in their analysis of high-altitude satellite photos, repeatedly confusing Scud missile storage places with the short, half-cylindrical sheds typically used to house poultry in Iraq. As a result, as the war neared, two teams of U.N. weapons experts acting on U.S. intelligence scrambled to search chicken coops for missiles that were not there.

LA Times

* This is embarrassing. And this is the best we had?

What I don't understand is why you have such faith that, despite all of the mounting evidence, something will turn up. They may yet find some artillery shells with chemical weapons left over from the Iran-Iraq War. But so what? The threat wasn't there.

Other members of AQ.

Hussein was a secular nationalist, Al Qaeda's real enemy. There's no particularly plausible reason to think that those groups would ally. If you're convinced that you know better than the (bi-partisan) 9/11 commission and experts like Richard Clarke, there's really no talking to you. You should just be clear that you're operating on the basis of a sort of religious faith when you say these things.

[SlaveNoMore]

Tyrone Slothrop
Hussein was a secular nationalist, Al Qaeda's real enemy. There's no particularly plausible reason to think that those groups would ally.

He was secular only to the extent he kept down the mullahs to keep himself in power.

But let's be honest, Ty. He played the muslim jihad card whenever and wherever convenient (e.g. paying off martyrs to kill Israelis, etc.)

And your buddy Atticus will remind you, that in the Arab world, the old adage "the enemy of my enemy is my friend" is a truism.

[Tyrone Slothrop]

Originally posted by SlaveNoMore
He was secular only to the extent he kept down the mullahs to keep himself in power.

But let's be honest, Ty. He played the muslim jihad card whenever and wherever convenient (e.g. paying off martyrs to kill Israelis, etc.)

From San Francisco, he may look pretty Islamic, but he is exactly the sort of secular totalitarian leader that Al Qaeda is rebelling against. They care about us only because we are over there, defiling Saudi Arabia and supporting secular regimes in places like Egypt. Their aim is to overthrow regimes like Hussein's, and to bring back a very different form Islam -- the revival of the Caliphate. Hussein may have made some noises in the last few years to stay in power, but they weren't fooled.

Incidentally, Syria is very similarly situated, and has a similarly hostility to the Islamists. They were giving us good intel on Islamic terrorists for a while.

And your buddy Atticus will remind you, that in the Arab world, the old adage "the enemy of my enemy is my friend" is a truism.

If that's the sort of wisdom that our foreign policy is based on, I would hate to have to explain that to the parents of soldiers killed over there.

The 9/11 commission suggests that OBL at least tried that line of reasoning on Hussein, but it also says that he didn't buy it. Maybe he needed better Arab folk advice.

[SlaveNoMore]

Tyrone Slothrop
From San Francisco, he may look pretty Islamic, but he is exactly the sort of secular totalitarian leader that Al Qaeda is rebelling against.

And yet, they never did. Odd dat, no?

[Not Me]

Originally posted by SlaveNoMore
...that at the mere demand for a donation, the "unemployed-male-known-as-Not Me" immediately ceased posting and went into hiding?

It would take more than that to get rid of me. I haven't been feeling well in the last few days and am praying to god that I am not pregnant if you must know. If I am not, I will convert to some sort of religion in a quid pro quo if he/she lets me off the hook. Anyone got any suggestions on which one? Islam is out. I like pork and shellfish too much to be a jew. I am thinking some sort of white bread protestant one will do. One that lets women be priests/preachers, but no snake charming/speaking in tongues crap. Also, I don't want to have to tithe.

As for donations, hey, I am unemployed, remember? If I get a job, you can bet the check will be in the mail.

[Tyrone Slothrop]

Originally posted by SlaveNoMore
And yet, they never did. Odd dat, no?

Saddam's secret police was pretty good. As is Egypt's. There's a reason that Al Qaeda gathered in Afghanistan and Chechnya -- both were lawless areas where they could fight alongside indigenous insurrections. The same was true in Bosnia for a while, until Western governments pressured the Bosnian Muslims to send the Arabs home.

Also, Al Qaeda has never had as many Iraqis as it has had recruits from other countries.

[SlaveNoMore]

Not Me
It would take more than that to get rid of me.

No, trust me, it won't.

I haven't been feeling well in the last few days

Pre-op hormone injections? Or all the TV dinners?

Also, I don't want to have to tithe....As for donations, hey, I am unemployed, remember? If I get a job, you can bet the check will be in the mail.

Tithe. What a great idea.

I'll tell you what. You donate 10% of your next two unemployment checks, and I'll stop harrassing you for being the ingrate idiot with (i) the 5th highest post total on the Board and (ii) the greatest posting average of anyone.

Paypal button is on the front page - upper right.

[sgtclub]

Originally posted by Greedy,Greedy,Greedy
Sudan stuff

You obviously know far more about the Sudan than I do. If it would only take a few thousand troops, I'd order it done tomorrow. I was under the impression it would take far more, and our military is pretty stretched as it is. Frankly, I wouldn't mind pulling out of western europe, for efficiency, geopolitical, and just plain spite.

[Not Me]

Originally posted by SlaveNoMore
(i) the 5th highest post total on the Board and (ii) the greatest posting average of anyone.

Yowsa. Now that is enougth to get rid of me. I think I might pull a bilmore for awhile.