Waiting for Fitzgerald

[taxwonk]

Originally posted by Mmmm, Burger (C.J.)
On para. 1, how is what you say consistent with the AMT, which removes the deduction for state income taxes?

I can't be an apologist for the AMT. It's a ridiculous construct which should be done away with immediately. If the G isn't happy with the fact that tax breaks allow certain people to pay less than their "fair share" of taxes, which is what the AMT purports to correct, then the tax breaks should be eliminated or ceilings should be put in place.

on para. 2, it favors the choice between sales and income taxes (or did for years). And why can't it "double" tax--we do it at the federal level alone, and it's done at myriad other levels as well, including by the states, who tax income that's also taxed by the federal gov't. I don't recall a deduction for federal taxes on any state income tax form I've completed (for at least four states).

Historically, tax policy has distinguished between taxes on net income and other types of tax. I don't think the rule always makes sense, particularly in the case of allowing a deduction for state income and property taxes but not sales tax.

As for taxation at the state level, the states haven't chosen to offer a deduction for federal income tax and the Eleventh Amendment prohibits the federal government from interviening in that decision, as well as the Anti-Injunction Act.

[Penske_Account]

Originally posted by Secret_Agent_Man
Do you know how sometimes, when your sphincter is really tight, you produce a very slender stool?

S_A_M

For efficiency's sake, many years back, I had elective surgery to install a state of the art colostomy bag waste disposal system, so I am having a tough time understanding what you are getting at but I am betting it is missing the mark. sts.

[taxwonk]

Originally posted by Penske_Account
too bad the government wasn't as considerate about the double taxation of dividends or of the death tax, but I guess we have to expect politicians who believe in a culture of death to also want to tax that event. Circular.

We've discussed dividend taxation on the board a number of times. A tax on dividends is not double taxation at the individual level because it both corporations and individuals are separate taxpayers. Furthermore, tax breaks for divindends have a regressive impact because they favor income of those who rely more on wealth than labor for their income.

If the federal government were to decide to try to better integrate corporate and shareholder taxation, a more appropriate response would be to allow the corporation a dividends-paid deduction. That would put dividends, a payment for the use of capital on more of a par with wages, which are payment for the use of labor, and interest, which is payment for the use of money.

It would also provide for a more equitable distribution of the overall tax burden, without favoring one source of value over another.

If you want to discuss the estate tax with me, then stop using offensive and misleading rhetorical devices and we'll talk.

[Penske_Account]

Originally posted by taxwonk
I can't be an apologist for the AMT. It's a ridiculous construct which should be done away with immediately. If the G isn't happy with the fact that tax breaks allow certain people to pay less than their "fair share" of taxes, which is what the AMT purports to correct, then the tax breaks should be eliminated or ceilings should be put in place.

2!

Originally posted by taxwonk


Historically, tax policy has distinguished between taxes on net income and other types of tax. I don't think the rule always makes sense, particularly in the case of allowing a deduction for state income and property taxes but not sales tax.

Isn't state sales tax deductible as of last year (for WA state sales tax it was and is) or is limited to some/certain states' sales taxes?

[taxwonk]

Originally posted by baltassoc
Sorry, catching up and not paying attention. This is the federal proposal, or some hypothetical proposal?

Is this the Balt Anal Rape Tax Reform Act of 2005? (BARTRA?)

(May well be both selling a house - no doubt for much less than I could if the interest were deductible - and buying a house - thereby eliminating my current deduction - very soon and not by choice).

The Bush Administration appointed an advisory group on tax policy. They issued two different proposals a couple of days ago. The elimination of mortgage and state tax deductions was a common feature of both proposals, although there were some small differences between the two.

[Penske_Account]

Originally posted by taxwonk
We've discussed dividend taxation on the board a number of times. A tax on dividends is not double taxation at the individual level because it both corporations and individuals are separate taxpayers. Furthermore, tax breaks for divindends have a regressive impact because they favor income of those who rely more on wealth than labor for their income.

If the federal government were to decide to try to better integrate corporate and shareholder taxation, a more appropriate response would be to allow the corporation a dividends-paid deduction. That would put dividends, a payment for the use of capital on more of a par with wages, which are payment for the use of labor, and interest, which is payment for the use of money.

It would also provide for a more equitable distribution of the overall tax burden, without favoring one source of value over another.

If you want to discuss the estate tax with me, then stop using offensive and misleading rhetorical devices and we'll talk.

I disagree and stand by the double taxation. Of course, you are self interested in the perpetuation of more taxes so I will take your comments with a grain of salt. Additionally, the demo party is interested in tearing down corporate america and undermining investment to allow for the eventual state appropriation of private industry when the Clintons' RedChinese handlers call in their chits. Sad.

As for rhetorical devices, I support life and its sanctity as directed by the babyjesi and will not be bowed by the culturalists of death wimpy protestations of tender feelings. When the left stops supporting a culture of death via death taxes and forced killings of disabled people then I willl stop rhetorically calling them to task for their evils.

[baltassoc]

Originally posted by taxwonk

Historically, tax policy has distinguished between taxes on net income and other types of tax. I don't think the rule always makes sense, particularly in the case of allowing a deduction for state income and property taxes but not sales tax.

But wasn't that distinction obviated by the "Hey My Buddies in Texas Pay Sales Not Income Tax Act of 2004"?

[taxwonk]

Originally posted by sebastian_dangerfield
Well, you've hit on my favorite pet peeve - the govt compiling stats, and making legislation, based on data averaged from every secotr of the country. I'm rich to a fucking dirt farming imbecile in WVa, but I ain't rich in Philly.

You're worrying about the rising cost of private schools, you wear $140 shirts, you're a DINK household, and you say you're not rich? Try running that past the cleaning crew in your office or the manger at your grocery store and see what they think.

The truth is that there is such a wide (and growing) gap between the haves and the have-nots in this country that there is hardly anything left of the middle class any more. The middle class used to be the cops and the office managers, and the average lawyers, who could afford a modest house and maybe two cars, one used, and possibly a two-week vacation every year. These people are almost all gone now. They haven't disappeared completely, but they are shrinking rapidly as a demographic.

[Penske_Account]

Originally posted by baltassoc
But wasn't that distinction obviated by the "Hey My Buddies in Texas Pay Sales Not Income Tax Act of 2004"?

Washington State got a benefit too. Perhaps that was a nod to my continued effourts here to educate the ignorant nattering nabobs here, but given the blue tint of this state I doubt it. Way to unfairly criticise the President no matter what he does though. The consistent bias of the left is at least heartening in its consistency.

[baltassoc]

Originally posted by Penske_Account
As for rhetorical devices, I support life and its sanctity as directed by the babyjesi and will not be bowed by the culturalists of death wimpy protestations of tender feelings. When the left stops supporting a culture of death via death taxes and forced killings of disabled people then I willl stop rhetorically calling them to task for their evils.

Generally, taxing something is considered a disincentive to it happening. Those who wish to stop taxing death would appear to want to promote it the most.

What is it that Republicans have against the living?

[Gattigap]

Originally posted by Penske_Account
I disagree and stand by the double taxation. Of course, you are self interested in the perpetuation of more taxes so I will take your comments with a grain of salt. Additionally, the demo party is interested in tearing down corporate america and undermining investment to allow for the eventual state appropriation of private industry when the Clintons' RedChinese handlers call in their chits. Sad.

As for rhetorical devices, I support life and its sanctity as directed by the babyjesi and will not be bowed by the culturalists of death wimpy protestations of tender feelings. When the left stops supporting a culture of death via death taxes and forced killings of disabled people then I willl stop rhetorically calling them to task for their evils.

Rubs to religious inconography in response to tax post: 1 (arguably 2, with the use of the plural)

Clinton references: 1

References to Democratic party: 3

References to death/evil: 4

Substantive response to double taxation: 0

Not bad. Sounds like you've hit the mark pretty accurately, Wonk.

[Penske_Account]

Originally posted by taxwonk
You're worrying about the rising cost of private schools, you wear $140 shirts, you're a DINK household, and you say you're not rich? Try running that past the cleaning crew in your office or the manger at your grocery store and see what they think.

I did and I am not sure the quality of life is not better for those people.

Originally posted by taxwonk


The truth is that there is such a wide (and growing) gap between the haves and the have-nots in this country that there is hardly anything left of the middle class any more. The middle class used to be the cops and the office managers, and the average lawyers, who could afford a modest house and maybe two cars, one used, and possibly a two-week vacation every year. These people are almost all gone now. They haven't disappeared completely, but they are shrinking rapidly as a demographic.

No, that is not the truth. Try getting out of your insular upper middle class suburban gated enclave and mingle with the real people, the middle class that does exist and maybe you would learn something. I live and socialise amongst the middle class, the working class, and you could not be further from the truth. On a daily basis I go into the worst neighbourhoods in my city and offer educational hope and social justive and there is a thriving culture of opportunity and ownership in our midst, but its not in the demos interest to promote it lest voters stray from the plantation. It is nice to see you perpetuating the lies of the Sharpton/Jackson/Pelosi wing of the looney left though.

[taxwonk]

Originally posted by Penske_Account
Isn't state sales tax deductible as of last year (for WA state sales tax it was and is) or is limited to some/certain states' sales taxes?

A sales tax deduction was enacted as part of the Jobs Creation Act.

[Penske_Account]

Originally posted by baltassoc
Generally, taxing something is considered a disincentive to it happening. Those who wish to stop taxing death would appear to want to promote it the most.

What is it that Republicans have against the living?

The demos are celebrating death by a confiscatory act of oppression on the survivors. That is the evil. The Rs support the living, i.e. the survivors.

[baltassoc]

Originally posted by taxwonk
A sales tax deduction was enacted as part of the Jobs Creation Act.

Right. I always get that name mixed up.