Fashion Board 2-3-04 to 3-5-04

[ltl/fb]

Originally posted by notcasesensitive
except in our hearts, of course. and on that vhs tape that lizard keeps under his pillow.

Surely he pulls it out some of the time.

[notcasesensitive]

Originally posted by ltl/fb
Surely he pulls it out some of the time.

yes, he pulls it out, and then he puts it back in, then he pulls it out and he acts like he'll put it back in but he hesitates a moment until you're really begging for it and he puts it back in really hard.

but then, you've seen the tape.

[NotFromHere]

Originally posted by notcasesensitive
except in our hearts, of course. and on that vhs tape that lizard keeps under his pillow.

Has the lizard not advanced to the 21st century yet? vhs tape? What the hell is that? You mean the lizard has a vcr? What the hell is that? I had one of those in like the early 90's but it died a long long time ago.

Tell your buddy that today's repitile will settle for nothing less than the unadulterated quality of digital.

[taxwonk]

Originally posted by Fugee
Could you both go back and read what I actually wrote and not what you think I wrote? I started by saying I don't know how God is going to deal with people who sincerely believe in God but by a different name. Maybe I should have put a semi-colon or period before my next statement that I'm pretty sure that people who reject God are toast to make it clearer that those were two different ideas. Or maybe you had your minds so made up about me that you would have missed that too.

Besides Wonk, there is stuff in the New Testament about rain forest type people so that's not even a fair characterization of Christianity -- they don't get toasted just because they never heard about Jesus. And before you ask why missionaries go out if that's the case, the answer is that belief in God is about more than a fire insurance policy.

I wasn't talking about people who believe in God but by a different name. I am talking about people for whom there is no God. Their belief system simply doesn't have the concept.

And I also took what you said at face value. A God who punishes those who reject him is not a God I believe in. I believe that God is all merciful and just and that maybe some people wind up somewhere on a continuum that is closer to ultimate fulfillment than others; I simply reject as a matter of faith the notion of a vengeful God.

[notcasesensitive]

Originally posted by NotFromHere
Has the lizard not advanced to the 21st century yet? vhs tape? What the hell is that? You mean the lizard has a vcr? What the hell is that? I had one of those in like the early 90's but it died a long long time ago.

Tell your buddy that today's repitile will settle for nothing less than the unadulterated quality of digital.

he's a bit of a Luddite. something about if it's good enough for the martians it sure as Notfredland should be good enough for our lame-ass species.

don't even get him started on cell phones.

[ThurgreedMarshall]

Originally posted by Fugee
When it comes to what happens after death, it is a matter of belief and faith no matter what you believe or don't.

Here's my question: Why would a God who can create the universe (and who knows what beyond that, if anything) care if you believed in him or not? Really? Why would that be important to Him? It seems kind of petty to me. Like if SD was your god or something. "Do you believe in me? Oh. You do now but where were you back when I wasn't it making it incredibly clear to you that I exist? Because, that's the real test. I'm not going to show you that I'm here, but boy are you in deep shit if you don't believe it! Off to hell with ya!"

Originally posted by Fugee
As I said to Sebby, one of us is going to get a surprise when it's all over. I'd hate for it to be me.

And here is the greatest, most powerful trick of most religions. If you don't believe everything we say and do what we tell you to do, you're going to pay for it for all of eternity. Sure, you can do what you want now. But your lifetime is just a drop in the bucket compared with all of eternity. Wouldn't you rather be sitting on clouds, playing with harps than the worst place in the world! With devils and those caves and the ragged clothing! And the heat! My god, the heat! Don't take that chance! Join us!

I believe there's a God. I believe there's an afterlife. And I'm pretty sure that when the time comes, He judges you not on whether or not you believe in him. It's about whether you have a basic value system that makes you a good person. And those values translate across all belief systems, including those that don't believe He exists.

But this is a stupid argument. It's like beating your head against the side of a church.

TM

[ltl/fb]

Originally posted by notcasesensitive
he's a bit of a Luddite. something about if it's good enough for the martians it sure as Notfredland should be good enough for our lame-ass species.

don't even get him started on cell phones.

It was a high school thing. Back when we were in high school, there was no dvd. He may have gotten it transferred -- the tape was getting so worn he was only able to use the tape on special occasions.

ncs, quit it, you're getting me all hot and bothered.

[taxwonk]

Originally posted by Atticus Grinch
Never thought I'd get tired of a religion discussion.

Does anyone have one of those >$100 fuzzy logic rice cookers? Care to wax rhapsodic about it and justify my impending purchase of one (we eat a fair amount of rice)? The likelihood I'd ever load one up and keep it full of hot, fluffy rice all day long is low. I need it to be fast, and foolproof, and non-stick.

Tell me it's Tivo for rice, and I'm all on that like white on, um, Michael Jackson.

Buy a nice saucepan, all-clad, calphalon, whatever. Put in the amount of rice you want to cook. If you're serving 2-3, one cup; if you're serving 4-6, two cups. Add precisely 1.75 times the amount of water as rice. This is just like baking or organic chemistry. Don't eyeball it or estimate. Actually measure. Bring it to a boil, stirring once or twice. Once the water is at a rolling boil, stir once to make sure that no rice is sticking to the bottom of the pan, cover it with a tight-fitting lid, set the burner on "simmer" and set the timer for 15 minutes. Once the timer goes off, remove the pot from the heat, let stand untouched for five minutes. You will have perfect rice every time.

Next time I'm in the City by the Bay, you owe me at least $25 worth of martinis. After those two, I'll pick up a round.

[ThurgreedMarshall]

Originally posted by Atticus Grinch
Never thought I'd get tired of a religion discussion.

Now that's rich.

TM

[GodFred]

Originally posted by Fugee
Here's my thinking. I do start with three assumptions: (1) That there actually is one ultimate God who created the universe and all of us and that there is life after death (without that assumption, who cares because we die and that's the end, period, nothing more), (2) This ultimate God gave us free will and will honor our choices, and (3) At some point a person's belief or unbelief can become so entrenched that nothing will change his or her mind (as support for this assumption, I give you the Holocaust "revisionists"). I'll do this with a hypothetical.

Let's say this ultimate God is called Fred and the place of eternal bliss with Fred is Fredland. I don't believe Fred is God. Not only that, I affirmatively reject Fred as God until my dying breath (because I said I don't know how God will deal with people who sincerely believe in God under a different name, the hypothetical is that this rejection is not because I think Ralph, not Fred, is God) . Should Fred force me into Fredland against my will? Let's say Fred is unbelievably more merciful than I could ever imagine and decides to give me one last chance to change my mind and believe in Fred just as I'm at the crossroads between Fredland and Nonfredland and reveals emself to me in all ems power and glory but like a little kid, I've (figuratively) got my eyes squeezed shut and am covering my ears yelling "There's no Fred! There's no Fred!" and continue to reject Fred. If Fred nevertheless pulled me into Fredland dsepite my rejection, isn't em disregarding my free will? In saying that people who reject God are "toast," I'm saying under that hypothetical, I would expect Fred to let me spend eternity in Nonfredland.

A lot of you might have trouble with my second assumption and think that God would only be just and merciful if em takes everyone to Heaven despite the choices they make. That is a matter of faith and belief as much as my belief that God honors our free will.

There are no vacancies at Fredland. You are toast!

Thanks for playin' though!

[SlaveNoMore]

ThurgreedMarshall
But this is a stupid argument. It's like beating your head against the side of a church.

I've seen your face. This explains it.

[Fugee]

Originally posted by ThurgreedMarshall
Just make it clear that you're speaking from a position of actual ignorance on the subject of God's intentions and acknowledge that your opinions are strengthened only by your unwavering faith and I won't call you on it.

Because I have arrived at my beliefs as a result of studying not only the Bible but also secular sources, I won't cop to "actual ignorance." I don't know what kind of study supports your beliefs so I can't even say whether I'm at a point of more or less ignorance than you. And because my faith has certainly wavered over the years (hence the study), I can't cop to unwavering faith.

I will say that I have a deep faith in God as I understand God to be based on the Bible, which I think is reliable based on historical church and non-church materials, and what I see in the world and people around me. It is faith and not fact because we can't see or know God or the lack of God or whether there is life after death in a tangible fashion.

You have a faith that sounds to be as strongly held as mine. How do you justify yours?

[GodFred]

Originally posted by Pretty Little Flower

I will.

[Skeks in the city]

Originally posted by bilmore

[RP's] got your thesaurus out again, don't you?

She uses big words when peeved.

[bold_n_brazen]

Originally posted by notcasesensitive
the promising slut calendar thread has been buried by the what is faith and why would anyone have it thread. ain't life grand.

Dude, I tried. I tried.

I lost to God. What are you gonna do?