Missing the Paigow (et al.) [sniff]

[ltl/fb]

Originally posted by nononono
Sensitivity in either direction is ridiculous. I think I could manage not to feel threatened if I were at a firm that threw a Hannukah party and didn't even throw in a token tabletop tree. Why on earth would I care? Or not want to participate? Or, God forbid, feel excluded?

On the other hand, throwing an end of the year celebration, or generic holiday party doesn't bug me, either, so long as it's in order to do that, not just out of fear of offending.

In my view, if a big American organization is going to throw a big huge party at the end of the year and expect all of their employees (no matter what their background) to show up and kinda expect most of their local clients to show up, they should call it something generic. I mean, unless it's Roman Inc., maker of Catholic stuff. Or if it's an actual church throwing the party.

If I am throwing a party, I can call it whatever I want. If it's a tree-decorating party, I might well call it a Christmas party. If it's a "let's drink hot drinks and huddle in front of the fire because it's the shortest day of the year and it's so dark out" party, I might call it a solstice party.

If I were working at British Aerospace's Los Angeles office, the office might throw a party on Guy Fawkes Day and call it that -- they are sharing an item of British (well, maybe just English, whatever, not sure) culture and inviting people who are not part of that culture to learn something about it or have another excuse to drink (and burn stuff!!). My company's office in France (uh, if we have one) might throw a 4th of July/Independence Day party to share that American holiday with its French employees and customers.

That is to say, the Bastille Day thing is distinguishable. You moron.

[Not Bob]

Originally posted by nononono
Actually if they were French they wouldn't care what it was called - they'd still consider it a Bastille Day party. :-) That said, if I were Pete (and not Pierre) I'd probably pipe up and agree with them.

Yes, you might. But if Francois doesn't know you, how is he to know that you wouldn't mind his comment? How does he know that you wouldn't think that he was an anti-American, ungrateful, would-be-speaking-German-if-it-weren't-for-Uncle-Sam-(twice) Gallic bastard?

Other Petes I know would indeed be pissed. And might take their business elsewhere. Jean-Claude would certainly not be pleased. Comments like Francois' are perhaps worse than just calling it a Bastille Day party from the get go.

[Did you just call me Coltrane?]

Originally posted by ltl/fb
In my view, if a big American organization is going to throw a big huge party at the end of the year and expect all of their employees (no matter what their background) to show up and kinda expect most of their local clients to show up, they should call it something generic. I mean, unless it's Roman Inc., maker of Catholic stuff. Or if it's an actual church throwing the party.

If I am throwing a party, I can call it whatever I want. If it's a tree-decorating party, I might well call it a Christmas party. If it's a "let's drink hot drinks and huddle in front of the fire because it's the shortest day of the year and it's so dark out" party, I might call it a solstice party.

If I were working at British Aerospace's Los Angeles office, the office might throw a party on Guy Fawkes Day and call it that -- they are sharing an item of British (well, maybe just English, whatever, not sure) culture and inviting people who are not part of that culture to learn something about it or have another excuse to drink (and burn stuff!!). My company's office in France (uh, if we have one) might throw a 4th of July/Independence Day party to share that American holiday with its French employees and customers.

That is to say, the Bastille Day thing is distinguishable. You moron.

You haven't been ass-fucked in awhile, have you?

[ltl/fb]

Originally posted by Hank Chinaski
You don't think she was fucking with you?

No. I explained that I was going to take it home.

[ThurgreedMarshall]

Originally posted by nononono
Sensitivity in either direction is ridiculous. I think I could manage not to feel threatened if I were at a firm that threw a Hannukah party and didn't even throw in a token tabletop tree. Why on earth would I care? Or not want to participate? Or, God forbid, feel excluded?

I love these "It's never going to happen to me because I am the center of the world and my version of the holidays is rammed down everyone's throat right now, but if it weren't and I were one of you, I wouldn't bitch about it" attitudes.*

It's not about being sensitive about what the holiday party is called. It's about the firm making an effort to recognize the people who work there. To acknowledge that yes, people who don't worship or celebrate the way we do are welcome here (at the firm) too. What I don't understand is av's attitude and I see it every year at the party and beyond. "Fuck that. I'm not calling this a holiday party. That's stupid. This so totally is a Christmas party, dude! Last I looked it was December and no one I know has a Chanukah party!"

Originally posted by nononono
On the other hand, throwing an end of the year celebration, or generic holiday party doesn't bug me, either, so long as it's in order to do that, not just out of fear of offending.

Yeah. We wouldn't ever want to think about the way we interact with people out of a <gasp> fear of offending them, would we?

TM

[nononono]

Originally posted by Not Bob
Yes, you might. But if Francois doesn't know you, how is he to know that you wouldn't mind his comment? How does he know that you wouldn't think that he was an anti-American, ungrateful, would-be-speaking-German-if-it-weren't-for-Uncle-Sam-(twice) Gallic bastard?

Other Petes I know would indeed be pissed. And might take their business elsewhere. Jean-Claude would certainly not be pleased. Comments like Francois' are perhaps worse than just calling it a Bastille Day party from the get go.

You and Fringey both raise a reasonable point - what makes business sense. So, to the extent people are overly sensitive about this shit, it would indeed be an ill-advised move to do something that will surely piss off your customers.

[nononono]

Originally posted by ThurgreedMarshall
I love these "It's never going to happen to me because I am the center of the world and my version of the holidays is rammed down everyone's throat right now, but if it weren't and I were one of you, I wouldn't bitch about it" attitudes.*

It's not about being sensitive about what the holiday party is called. It's about the firm making an effort to recognize the people who work there. To acknowledge that yes, people who don't worship or celebrate the way we do are welcome here (at the firm) too. What I don't understand is av's attitude and I see it every year at the party and beyond. "Fuck that. I'm not calling this a holiday party. That's stupid. This so totally is a Christmas party, dude! Last I looked it was December and no one I know has a Chanukah party!"

Yeah. We wouldn't ever want to think about the way we interact with people out of a <gasp> fear of offending them, would we?

TM

Fine, so you're sensitive. I'm not. I am, however, amused by you chiding someone to thnk about the way one interacts with people out of <gasp> a fear of offending them.

eta, I agree that grumbling about it/actually being really mad about it is silly as well.

[Not Bob]

Originally posted by ThurgreedMarshall
It's not about being sensitive about what the holiday party is called. It's about the firm making an effort to recognize the people who work there.

Fuck the workers. I care about the effect on clients.

Kiddding aside, Not Bob & Associates LLP doesn't have an employee party -- we have a catered employee luncheon (yes, with booze) on the last day that turns into an extra day off with pay.

[ThurgreedMarshall]

Originally posted by nononono
It's so strange; I've started to like you. Even if you are the tiniest bit predictable.

Funny. I still feel the same way about you.

Originally posted by nononono
I know the point of a "holiday party." Debate isn't over what is done; it's over whether that is necessary.

Right. let's run through that Bastille Day argument again.

Originally posted by nononono
As far as a Dumbass Day Party, is that your way of asking me out on a date? Because you know you'd be first on my invite list for that intimate little gathering.

You need to work on this. Hank had no clue when he first got here either. Now, at least he has his own style. This insult is just pathetic.

TM

[nononono]

Originally posted by ThurgreedMarshall
Funny. I still feel the same way about you.

Right. let's run through that Bastille Day argument again.

You need to work on this. Hank had no clue when he first got here either. Now, at least he has his own style. This insult is just pathetic.

TM

I'm feeling all warm and fuzzy now.

[ThurgreedMarshall]

Originally posted by ltl/fb
In my view, if a big American organization is going to throw a big huge party at the end of the year and expect all of their employees (no matter what their background) to show up and kinda expect most of their local clients to show up, they should call it something generic. I mean, unless it's Roman Inc., maker of Catholic stuff. Or if it's an actual church throwing the party.

If I am throwing a party, I can call it whatever I want. If it's a tree-decorating party, I might well call it a Christmas party. If it's a "let's drink hot drinks and huddle in front of the fire because it's the shortest day of the year and it's so dark out" party, I might call it a solstice party.

If I were working at British Aerospace's Los Angeles office, the office might throw a party on Guy Fawkes Day and call it that -- they are sharing an item of British (well, maybe just English, whatever, not sure) culture and inviting people who are not part of that culture to learn something about it or have another excuse to drink (and burn stuff!!). My company's office in France (uh, if we have one) might throw a 4th of July/Independence Day party to share that American holiday with its French employees and customers.

That is to say, the Bastille Day thing is distinguishable. You moron.

Go 'head witcha bad self.

TM

[ltl/fb]

Originally posted by ThurgreedMarshall
Go 'head witcha bad self.

TM

Are you doing that back-and-forth thing with your head?

[ThurgreedMarshall]

Originally posted by nononono
You and Fringey both raise a reasonable point - what makes business sense. So, to the extent people are overly sensitive about this shit, it would indeed be an ill-advised move to do something that will surely piss off your customers.

You. are. stupid.

Employers apply this analysis to how they deal with their employees as well, you numbskull. And even if the goal isn't 100% business related, many people would still believe it is worthwhile.

TM

[taxwonk]

Originally posted by Hank Chinaski
To the extent the Jews in Podunk are bothered by being invited to a "Christmas Party," the extent they are bothered pales in comparision to how much the quality of the deli in Podunk bothers them. Wonk. You've been to Podunk- how's the Pastrami?

Pastrami in Podunk? They have Vienna at the deli counter over by the Jewel's, that pretty much sums it up. And half the time, the goyim don't even know to slice across the grain. On the other hand, I am disgusted to report that there are exactly two places in the Loop that serve a decent pastrami sandwich these days. I blame Chipotle and Quiznos.

[ThurgreedMarshall]

Originally posted by ltl/fb
Are you doing that back-and-forth thing with your head?

No. That's done with the "you go girl" crap and no one should ever say "you go girl" or move their head in that way.

Mine is more of a "step back and let fringe handle my light work" thing.

TM