Implanting Bill Gates's Micro-chips In Brains For Over 20 Years!

[Adder]

Originally Posted by Icky Thump

I side with Israel 100% because they're an ally.

Can we at least be at least a little uncomfortable about bombing civilians who are essentially trapped in an open air prison?

There are victims of Hamas on both sides of the border.

[sebastian_dangerfield]

Originally Posted by Adder

Can we at least be at least a little uncomfortable about bombing civilians who are essentially trapped in an open air prison?

There are victims of Hamas on both sides of the border.

Yes, and we should be. I also 100% side with the notion that the Palestinians in Gaza who are not Hamas or Hamas supporters do not deserve what they're getting.

Your second point is most important, and isn't being stated nearly as often as it should. The responsibility for the deaths of innocent Palestinians in the Israeli siege lies exclusively with Hamas, who decided to go ISIS on a much stronger neighbor and desired - sought exactly - the violent response that resulted. And then, cowards they are, slunk back into Gaza and used the Palestinians they pretend to care about as human shields.

Hamas might as well have saved gasoline and massacred the innocent Palestinians of Gaza itself. Because that's exactly what it did when it decided to go medeival on Israel. And why did it do it? To protect itself. If Israel and SA inked that peace deal, Hamas was permanently marginalized. Hamas might minimally care about Palestinians, but what it really cares about most, with everything else a very distant second, is its own power and survival. It'd rather keep the Palestinians in squalor and stay in power than improve their lives and concede its power.

[Tyrone Slothrop]

Originally Posted by sebastian_dangerfield

The responsibility for the deaths of innocent Palestinians in the Israeli siege lies exclusively with Hamas, who decided to go ISIS on a much stronger neighbor and desired - sought exactly - the violent response that resulted.

Uh, no. Just like Hamas, Israel is responsible for its actions.

[sebastian_dangerfield]

Originally Posted by Tyrone Slothrop

Uh, no. Just like Hamas, Israel is responsible for its actions.

Not if it has no options. And I don’t see any options.

[Tyrone Slothrop]

Originally Posted by sebastian_dangerfield

Not if it has no options. And I don’t see any options.

That's using rhetoric instead of your brain.

[Hank Chinaski]

Originally Posted by Tyrone Slothrop

Uh, no. Just like Hamas, Israel is responsible for its actions.

Yes. It has to be.

[Adder]

Originally Posted by sebastian_dangerfield

The responsibility for the deaths of innocent Palestinians in the Israeli siege lies exclusively with Hamas

No, not exclusively. Israel also has agency.

[sebastian_dangerfield]

Originally Posted by Adder

No, not exclusively. Israel also has agency.

And Israel is using that agency to act appropriately. Its providing time for Gazans to evacuate, and it is telling people near Hamas locations that it is going to bomb those locations, to avoid civilian casualties.

[Adder]

Originally Posted by sebastian_dangerfield

And Israel is using that agency to act appropriately.

Are the water and electricity still shut off?

[sebastian_dangerfield]

Let’s kill the “look at another cause” argument right here. Because it is garbage.

Netanyahu is at fault. Significant fault. He did strengthen Hamas as part of a cynical strategy to avoid a two state solution. Totally true from what I’ve read.

And he should be held responsible for doing that. And will be.

But that is a different thing from what Hamas did, and never let anyone conflate them. His crime is setting the stage for violence. Hamas then engaged in violence.

Making the argument that Netanyahu is responsible is a dodge. It is meant to detract from what Hamas did. Hamas had agency. It could’ve bombed. It could’ve held territory or even taken hostages and traded them for concessions. Instead, it massacred civilians.

Netanyahu owns his sin of setting the stage. But to attempt to change the subject and focus on him with the silly suggestion he’s somehow culpable for Hamas’ acts is deflection too moronic for serious consideration. It’s also the dumbest victim shaming. “You knew Cletus packed and was a mean drunk and bought him whiskey because you wanted to hit on his cute sister who was also at the bar! You deserve him shooting you!”

[Tyrone Slothrop]

Originally Posted by sebastian_dangerfield

Let’s kill the “look at another cause” argument right here. Because it is garbage.

Netanyahu is at fault. Significant fault. He did strengthen Hamas as part of a cynical strategy to avoid a two state solution. Totally true from what I’ve read.

And he should be held responsible for doing that. And will be.

But that is a different thing from what Hamas did, and never let anyone conflate them. His crime is setting the stage for violence. Hamas then engaged in violence.

Making the argument that Netanyahu is responsible is a dodge. It is meant to detract from what Hamas did. Hamas had agency. It could’ve bombed. It could’ve held territory or even taken hostages and traded them for concessions. Instead, it massacred civilians.

Netanyahu owns his sin of setting the stage. But to attempt to change the subject and focus on him with the silly suggestion he’s somehow culpable for Hamas’ acts is deflection too moronic for serious consideration. It’s also the dumbest victim shaming. “You knew Cletus packed and was a mean drunk and bought him whiskey because you wanted to hit on his cute sister who was also at the bar! You deserve him shooting you!”

No one here has said that Netanyahu is culpable for Hamas's acts. If you want to engage with stupid things that no one reasonable is saying, that's what Twitter is for. If you want to engage with other people here, read what they are actually saying and respond to that.