Patting the wrists, rolling the eyes.

[Hank Chinaski]

Mary Mapes- the girlie who tried to throw the Presidential electionwith her fellow traveler Dan Rather, you remember her right?

Well her book is coming out- I probably won't read it- but here's the money quote:

• “Conservative bloggers are part of the story. They have vilified me, mounted a “wilding” attack against me…we were, it seemed the first victims of a new kind of digital McCarthyism, which uses the same techniques as the old McCarthyism–rumors, slurs, false charges and ugly attacks

That this numbskull, who should be in prison for the shit she tried to pull, could complain of "the same techniques as the old McCarthyism–rumors, slurs, false charges and ugly attacks," given that that is what she did is funny! That tens of thousands of the Democrats will buy her book and sympathze show who the dumb ones are in the great debate-

[silent but deadly]

Originally posted by taxwonk

p.s., If you want to come out, just pm me. I'll give up my info if you give up yours.

Get a room already.

[Tyrone Slothrop]

Originally posted by Say_hello_for_me
Rehnquist is one. Believe me, I'm distant enough from the Court that I base my thoughts on what I read... and a lot of that was back when I had time to read stuff other than the papers. Which is to say, I wasn't thinking "Rummy? Stimpy?, dammit... what's his name agin?". Rather, just that there was a close case not so long ago that almost did it.

I'm assuming the 4th dissenter in Casey has since retired, but I can't remember who it was and who the replacement is.

Kennedy is a wild card. Seriously, I think one could envision that him and one or two others just want the solid numbers and the solid rationale in-place to overturn Roe. Not because they think Roe was right in the first place, but because they don't like overturning precedent, and they don't (editorial comment: and shouldn't) want to zigzag on this and appear like they are appeasing a political constituency.

So, what I think gets this done is:
1.) Enough time to make it something other than politically reactive;

2.) 5 people to sign onto a single opinion that says "this ain't none of our business, and never was" (as compared to multiple concurrences that make it seems like nobody really agrees on the law);

3.) and a plausible rationale for overturning and discrediting precedent... mebbe viability or sumthing.

I'm comfortable with 1 and 2, and a little sketchy on what they would use for 3.

But I'm comfortable that nobody in those robes can offer a coherent defense of an incoherent opinion.

Hello

The Republican Party would be in a world of hurt if Roe were overturned.

[taxwonk]

Originally posted by silent but deadly
Get a room already.

Yep. That's what I figured.

[ltl/fb]

Originally posted by Tyrone Slothrop
The Republican Party would be in a world of hurt if Roe were overturned.

I don't necessarily agree with this, but maybe I am overly pessimistic. It would probably hurt them in states that are already majority D, but I'm not so sure it would hurt them in TX or NE or WY.

[Tyrone Slothrop]

Originally posted by ltl/fb
I don't necessarily agree with this, but maybe I am overly pessimistic. It would probably hurt them in states that are already majority D, but I'm not so sure it would hurt them in TX or NE or WY.

It would hurt them everywhere, since it would mobilize Dem voters whose counterparts on the GOP side are already mobilized by the issue, and since pro-choice moderates would see their options actually limited.

[Say_hello_for_me]

Originally posted by Tyrone Slothrop
The Republican Party would be in a world of hurt if Roe were overturned.

Or so you guys keep telling us.
Yet, as best I can tell, California would be losing population if it weren't for illegals, Massachusetts is losing population even after illegals are counted, and Illinois is losing its employers and employees (read: tax base).

Seems to me, people are already voting with their feet

[ltl/fb]

Originally posted by Tyrone Slothrop
It would hurt them everywhere, since it would mobilize Dem voters whose counterparts on the GOP side are already mobilized by the issue, and since pro-choice moderates would see their options actually limited.

I don't see that making a difference in several places -- where there aren't a ton of moderate Rs, and even the Dems are pretty conservative. I guess they could start losing some swing states.

[Replaced_Texan]

Originally posted by Gattigap
NYT:

• WASHINGTON, April 14 - As the Senate heads toward a showdown over the rules governing judicial confirmations, Senator Bill Frist, the majority leader, has agreed to join a handful of prominent Christian conservatives in a telecast portraying Democrats as "against people of faith" for blocking President Bush's nominees.
  
  Fliers for the telecast, organized by the Family Research Council and scheduled to originate at a Kentucky megachurch the evening of April 24, call the day "Justice Sunday" and depict a young man holding a Bible in one hand and a gavel in the other. The flier does not name participants, but under the heading "the filibuster against people of faith," it reads: "The filibuster was once abused to protect racial bias, and it is now being used against people of faith."

You're right, Hank. This social policy stuff isn't really driven by GOP leadership, and can be easily tempered. I don't know what we were worried about.

Have I mentioned lately that I hate Republicans?

[Tyrone Slothrop]

Originally posted by Hank Chinaski
so i thought maybe we could review-

Earlier this week Ty pointed to one his deep thinker's very astute analysis that decided while Bush will achieve a Democracy in Iraq- it wasn't worth it.

I think it nice to reivew how his boys (and girl) have moved.

• Brent Scowcroft predicted on the eve of the Iraqi elections that voting there would increase the risk of civil war. Indeed, he foresaw “a great potential for deepening the conflict.” He also once assured us that Iraq “could become a Vietnam in a way that the Vietnam war never did.” Did he mean perhaps worse than ten years of war and over 50,000 American dead, with the Cambodian holocaust next door?

Perhaps he did, but without some more context, it's hard to say whether that was the "way" he meant.

• Zbigniew Brzezinski feared that we could not do what we are in fact presently doing in Iraq: “I do not think we can stay in Iraq in the fashion we’re in now…If it cannot be changed drastically, it should be terminated.” He added ominously that it would take 500,000 troops, $500 billion, and resumption of the military draft to achieve security in Iraq. Did he mean Iraq needed more American troops than did the defense of Europe in the Cold War?

Maybe so, if you're just referring to the U.S. troops stationed there, and not to others ready to be deployed, and if you're ignoring all of the European troops that helped defend Europe but whose numbers have not been matched in Iraq.

• Madeleine Albright, while abroad, summed up the present American foreign policy: “It's difficult to be in France and criticize my government. But I'm doing so because Bush and the people working for him have a foreign policy that is not good for America, not good for the world.” Elections in Afghanistan and Iraq, troops out of Saudi Arabia, democratic demonstrations in Lebanon, West Bank voting, promises of change in Egypt — all that and more is “not good for the world”?

Even crediting our foreign policy for things like the demonstrations in Lebanon, on balance, no, relative to the alternatives.

[chad87655]

Originally posted by Tyrone Slothrop
It would hurt them everywhere, since it would mobilize Dem voters whose counterparts on the GOP side are already mobilized by the issue, and since pro-choice moderates would see their options actually limited.

Spoken like a true naively arrogant liberal elitist. The truth is once you get 40 miles out from the pseudo-intellectual salons of your Gomorrahesque enclaves of Berkely, Greenwich Village and Georgetown, there would be three cheers arising from the majority of this country. Scratch the surface a bit and you will see how its solely the imperialistic Judicial autocracy that has created and nutured this culture of death in America. 59 million strong voted for life in November, the Demos can't touch that no matter how shrillly Allred and Estrich shriek.

The Day of Reckoning is coming. Batton down your hatches and say a prayer (if you know one).

[Spanky]

Originally posted by Say_hello_for_me
Or so you guys keep telling us.
Yet, as best I can tell, California would be losing population if it weren't for illegals, Massachusetts is losing population even after illegals are counted, and Illinois is losing its employers and employees (read: tax base).

Seems to me, people are already voting with their feet

Again, you are living in a dream world and not paying attention to the facts. The Blue states are much more solid Dem than the populous Red states are solid red. If Roe is overturned and abortion becomes the defining issue it is all over for the Republicans nationwide. Florida is full of moderate Republicans that have migrated from the north. The southwest is all on the edge - Arizona, New Mexico, and Colorado would all become solid blue. The only large state that would stay with the Republicans is Texas. With Florida, Illinois, New York, Ohio, Pennsylvania and California all solid blue the Republicans would not be able to win the presidency. The South and the non-pacific west do not constitute a majority.

[ltl/fb]

Originally posted by Spanky
Again, you are living in a dream world and not paying attention to the facts. The Blue states are much more solid Dem than the populous Red states are solid red. If Roe is overturned and abortion becomes the defining issue it is all over for the Republicans nationwide. Florida is full of moderate Republicans that have migrated from the north. The southwest is all on the edge - Arizona, New Mexico, and Colorado would all become solid blue. The only large state that would stay with the Republicans is Texas. With Florida, Illinois, New York, Ohio, Pennsylvania and California all solid blue the Republicans would not be able to win the presidency. The South and the non-pacific west do not constitute a majority.

Thanks, I feel much better now.

[Tyrone Slothrop]

Originally posted by Say_hello_for_me
Or so you guys keep telling us.
Yet, as best I can tell, California would be losing population if it weren't for illegals, Massachusetts is losing population even after illegals are counted, and Illinois is losing its employers and employees (read: tax base).

Seems to me, people are already voting with their feet

And Western states that are growing are becoming more Democratic as they do so: Nevada, Arizona, Colorado. People who move from California, Massachusetts and Illinois to places like Nevada, Arizona and Colorado bring their politics with them.

And I don't understand what any of that has to do with my point. Politics is more than a series of exit polls. If Roe were reversed and abortion could be criminalized on a statewide basis, you would see an enormous mobilization around the issue on the left, comparable at the least to what you've seen with abortion on your side for the past three decades. People who already disagree with you would start to work a lot harder, instead of sitting back and letting the courts worry about it. That's one. You'd also see lots of moderate voters who are pro-choice, at least to an extent, who would feel threatened by the militant pro-life wing of the GOP. Right now, the GOP can play to that base and keep them riled up without doing much of anything for them. Has Bush and the GOP Congress made much of an effort to curtail abortion? No. And they can blame the Supreme Court for that. Without Roe to blame, they would have to take the heat for pissing off either moderates or their own most fervid supporters. I would like to see all of that happen, even though I know that it would make abortions unavailable to a great many people, because I think it would a better thing for the country in the long run. And I'm hardly the only Democrat who thinks this.

[Tyrone Slothrop]

Originally posted by chad87655
Spoken like a true naively arrogant liberal elitist. The truth is once you get 40 miles out from the pseudo-intellectual salons of your Gomorrahesque enclaves of Berkely, Greenwich Village and Georgetown, there would be three cheers arising from the majority of this country. Scratch the surface a bit and you will see how its solely the imperialistic Judicial autocracy that has created and nutured this culture of death in America. 59 million strong voted for life in November, the Demos can't touch that no matter how shrillly Allred and Estrich shriek.

The Day of Reckoning is coming. Batton down your hatches and say a prayer (if you know one).

I've lived longer in the heartland than you have, my socky friend.