Politics: Where we struggle to kneel in the muck.

[Tyrone Slothrop]

Originally posted by SlaveNoMore
From the October 4, 2004 issue of the Weekly Standard:

The disgraceful behavior of John Kerry and his team is sufficient grounds for concern about his fitness to be president
by William Kristol
10/04/2004, Volume 010, Issue 04

• WE REALLY DON'T KNOW what a President John Kerry would do about Iraq. His flip-flops about the war, his inconsistencies, the ambiguity of his current position (win or withdraw?)--all of these mean we can only guess about a Kerry presidency. He would probably be inclined to get out of Iraq as soon as possible; it might be the case, however, that as president he would nonetheless find himself staying and fighting. Who knows?
  
  What we do know is this: Kerry and his advisers have behaved disgracefully this past week. That behavior is sufficient grounds for concern about his fitness to be president.
  
  On Tuesday, President Bush spoke to the United Nations General Assembly. Senator Kerry decided not to say anything supportive of the president as he made the American case to the "international community." Nor did he simply campaign that day on other issues. No. Less than an hour after President Bush finished speaking in New York, Kerry was criticizing his remarks in Jacksonville, Florida: "At the United Nations today, the president failed to level with the world's leaders. Moments after Kofi Annan, the secretary general, talked about the difficulties in Iraq, the president of the United States stood before a stony-faced body and barely talked about the realities at all of Iraq. . . . He does not have the credibility to lead the world."
  
  So Kerry credits Kofi Annan--who a few days before had condemned the "illegal" American war in Iraq--as a more accurate source of information on the subject than the president of the United States. Kerry also seems to think it significant that the General Assembly sat "stony-faced" while the president spoke. Would the applause of delegates from China, Sudan, Iran, Saudi Arabia, and, yes, France, have made the president's speech more praiseworthy in Kerry's eyes?
  
  Then Kerry was asked about Kofi Annan's description of the war in Iraq as an "illegal" invasion. Kerry answered: "I don't know what the law, the legalities are that he's referring to. I don't know." So the U.S. government is accused of breaking international law, and Kerry chooses not to defend his country against the charge, or to label it ridiculous or offensive. He is agnostic.
  
  Then Kerry continued: "Well, let me say this to all of you: That underscores what I am saying. If the leader of the United Nations is at odds with the legality, and we're not working at getting over that hurdle and bringing people to the table, as I said in my speech yesterday, it's imperative to be able to build international cooperation." It's our fault that the U.N. is doing almost nothing to help in Iraq. After all, according to Kerry, "Kofi Annan offered the help of the United Nations months ago. This president chose to go the other way."
  
  Leave aside the rewriting of history going on here. The president of the United States had just appealed for help from the United Nations and its member states to ensure that elections go forward in Iraq. Kerry could have reinforced that appeal for help with his own, thereby making it a bipartisan request. He chose instead to give the U.N., France, Germany, and everyone else an excuse to do nothing over these next crucial five weeks, with voter registration scheduled to begin November 1. If other nations prefer not to help the United States, the Democratic presidential candidate has given them his blessing.
  
  Two days later, Iraqi prime minister Ayad Allawi spoke to a joint meeting of Congress. Sen. Kerry could not be troubled to attend, as a gesture of solidarity and respect. Instead, Kerry said in Ohio that Allawi was here simply to put the "best face on the policy." So much for an impressive speech by perhaps America's single most important ally in the war on terror, the courageous and internationally recognized leader of a nation struggling to achieve democracy against terrorist opposition.
  
  But Kerry's rudeness paled beside the comment of his senior adviser, Joe Lockhart, to the Los Angeles Times: "The last thing you want to be seen as is a puppet of the United States, and you can almost see the hand underneath the shirt today moving the lips."
  
  Is Kerry proud that his senior adviser's derisive comment about the leader of free Iraq will now be quoted by terrorists and by enemies of the United States, in Iraq and throughout the Middle East? Is the concept of a loyalty to American interests that transcends partisan politics now beyond the imagination of the Kerry campaign?
  
  John Kerry has decided to pursue a scorched-earth strategy in this campaign. He is prepared to insult allies, hearten enemies, and denigrate efforts to succeed in Iraq. His behavior is deeply irresponsible--and not even in his own best interest.
  
  There is some chance, after all, that John Kerry will be president in four months. If so, what kind of situation will he have created for himself? France will smile on him, but provide no troops. Those allies that have provided troops, from Britain and Poland and Australia and Japan and elsewhere, will likely recall how Kerry sneered at them, calling them "the coerced and the bribed." The leader of the government in Iraq, upon whom the success of John Kerry's Iraq policy will depend, will have been weakened before his enemies and ours--and will also remember the insult. Is this really how Kerry wants to go down in history: Willing to say anything to try to get elected, no matter what the damage to the people of Iraq, to American interests, and even to himself?
  
  --William Kristol

You're going to blame Kerry for pointing out that Allawi is a puppet instead of Bush for bringing his puppet to the United States to campaign for him? Get real. At least Lockhart was polite. The blunt way to put it is that Allawi is Bush's bitch. Did he have to register as a 529 or is he just part of the Bush/Cheney campaign? In all seriousness, if he didn't want people to call him a puppet, he could have gotten his own talking points instead of using the ones provided by the campaign. You eschew a bipartisan foreign policy and staff the CPA with Republican hacks, and so on, and this is what you get.

[Hank Chinaski]

Originally posted by Tyrone Slothrop
You're going to blame Kerry for pointing out that Allawi is a puppet instead of Bush for bringing his puppet to the United States to campaign for him? Get real. At least Lockhart was polite. The blunt way to put it is that Allawi is Bush's bitch. Did he have to register as a 529 or is he just part of the Bush/Cheney campaign? In all seriousness, if he didn't want people to call him a puppet, he could have gotten his own talking points instead of using the ones provided by the campaign. You eschew a bipartisan foreign policy and staff the CPA with Republican hacks, and so on, and this is what you get.

Bush 311 and about to go to 360 with Mi. and Pa.


Ty, Allawi is on more solid ground in a greater % of Iraq than Kerry is in the States. If you blend the blue and red you don't get purple, you only get bluish red.

[Say_hello_for_me]

I'd lay 10-1 on VA and 5-1 on FLA going for Bush too.

and conf: to the people of Illinois... the beatings will continue until you have the sense to cleanse both parties in the state of their filth.

[Hank Chinaski]

Originally posted by Shape Shifter
I hardly see how a statue in Lubbock qualifies him as overrated.

the Crickets didn't have a horn player, right?

[Hank Chinaski]

Originally posted by Greedy,Greedy,Greedy
Hey! I know! Let's raise up a crusade and take back the Holy Land (and everything else within 1000 miles of it)!

There you go! This is Kerry's first position! We can respect this, or lets not, but you all can't keep changing.

[taxwonk]

Originally posted by SlaveNoMore
From the October 4, 2004 issue of the Weekly Standard:

A whole lot of blather about how Kerry has a duty to get Dim Son's six even if he's wrong, and how Kerry is supposed to back up Shrub's hand-picked puppet in Iraq notwithstanding that the man has no legitimacy other than that we put him there, as the freely-chosen representative of the Iraqi people

Bill Kristol is nothing but an enflamed, pustulent boil on the angry buttocks of American right-wing agitprop. I might as well claim credibility for Ralph Nader as the true voice of liberal America.

[SlaveNoMore]

Tyrone Slothrop
You're going to blame Kerry for pointing out that Allawi is a puppet instead of Bush for bringing his puppet to the United States to campaign for him? Get real. At least Lockhart was polite. The blunt way to put it is that Allawi is Bush's bitch. Did he have to register as a 529 or is he just part of the Bush/Cheney campaign? In all seriousness, if he didn't want people to call him a puppet, he could have gotten his own talking points instead of using the ones provided by the campaign. You eschew a bipartisan foreign policy and staff the CPA with Republican hacks, and so on, and this is what you get.

The reason Josh Marsall used to spew nonsense like this was clear - he was angling for a spokesman position in the [Democrat Nominee of the moment's] cabinet. Even he, realizing this is a suicidal, worthless position to take these days, has gone more macro.

Yglesias [who - now that I researched it - is a clueless, pompous asshole] still doesn't get it [but then again, unlike Josh, he needs a rep and a good job] and still shares this seditious sentiment.

Ty, I love you man, but for you to defend Lockhart on this is sad. I called Bush out on steel and farm and the Marriage Amendment. Step the fuck up, get off the party line and realize the damage these disgusting comments make.

PS - 5 1/2

[SlaveNoMore]

taxwonk
Bill Kristol is nothing but an enflamed, pustulent boil on the angry buttocks of American right-wing agitprop. I might as well claim credibility for Ralph Nader as the true voice of liberal America.

Name one single, responsible, TRUE voice of the left - then perhaps we can talk.



Give it up after 10 minutes. It isn't worth the headache.

[SlaveNoMore]

Hank Chinaski
Bush 311 and about to go to 360 with Mi. and Pa.


Ty, Allawi is on more solid ground in a greater % of Iraq than Kerry is in the States. If you blend the blue and red you don't get purple, you only get bluish red.

Bush gets 50.5% - routs Electoral

Dems rout Mid-Terms [but GOP still hold tenuous control; Party insurgents switch focus]

Guiliani v. H. Clinton rematch* in 2008!!!!


*delayed 8 years by cancer, divorce (both?) and terrorism

[Tyrone Slothrop]

Originally posted by SlaveNoMore
The reason Josh Marsall used to spew nonsense like this was clear - he was angling for a spokesman position in the [Democrat Nominee of the moment's] cabinet. Even he, realizing this is a suicidal, worthless position to take these days, has gone more macro.

Yglesias [who - now that I researched it - is a clueless, pompous asshole] still doesn't get it [but then again, unlike Josh, he needs a rep and a good job] and still shares this seditious sentiment.

Ty, I love you man, but for you to defend Lockhart on this is sad. I called Bush out on steel and farm and the Marriage Amendment. Step the fuck up, get off the party line and realize the damage these disgusting comments make.

PS - 5 1/2

Your guys diminished Allawi by using him as a campaign prop. What you're saying is like complaining that it's dangerous to our troops to point out what a mess Iraq is. What's dangerous is the mess. Pointing it out is likely to save some lives down the road.

[Adder]

Originally posted by SlaveNoMore
Step the fuck up, get off the party line and realize the damage these disgusting comments make.

What damage? You think he said anything the world doesn't know already?

[Adder]

Originally posted by SlaveNoMore
Name one single, responsible, TRUE voice of the left - then perhaps we can talk.



Give it up after 10 minutes. It isn't worth the headache.

What is "the left?" Its hard to name a "true" voice of the left, because the left is no monolith. You have labor, you have progressives, you have barely reformed socialists, and you have DLC/Clinton-style new democrats. Which one would you like a voice for?

You can point to "true" voices of the right because the right seems to have largely reduced itself to two basic types. You have your bible-thumping social conservatives and you have your classic fiscal consersatives who are rapidly abandoning their principles in and effort to stay in power by prentending to be bible-thumping social conservatives.

[Adder]

Originally posted by Tyrone Slothrop
So Kerry credits Kofi Annan--who a few days before had condemned the "illegal" American war in Iraq--as a more accurate source of information on the subject than the president of the United States.

And why does this get conservatives all up in arms? From Annan's perspective, as Secretary General of the U.N., the war was clearly illegal - it was a use of force not authorized by the U.N. security counsel.

The fact that you don't believe in international law doesn't make it not illegal to those who do.

Ad(and for the record, whether it was legal or not is completely beside the point)der

[taxwonk]

Originally posted by SlaveNoMore
Name one single, responsible, TRUE voice of the left - then perhaps we can talk.



Give it up after 10 minutes. It isn't worth the headache.

Michael Kinsley and Bill Saletan. I don't know if it's a coincidence or not that they both write for Slate.

I also like Aaron Sorkin, but he's probably in rehab these days.

[Say_hello_for_me]

http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmp...h_airstrikes_1

On the one hand, debate about who is being killed (and how many). On the other, an admission that they are concerned enough about spies dropping targeting transmitters around desired sites that they distributed a video on one being executed.

Meantime, Powell says the U.S. is going back in. It sounds like they realize it would be embarrassing not to have some whole cities voting.

Hello