Fashionistas you have arrived 3-25-03 - 10-3-03

[robustpuppy]

Originally posted by ThurgreedMarshall
My wife was a teacher and will most likely go back to being one at some point, but right now she is at home with the kid. She is intelligent, opinionated, interesting and goal oriented. One of her goals is to raise our children the way we would like them to be raised. Not to hire someone to raise them their way.

TM

You're a dad? To quote Keanu, whoa.

Good response, by the way.

r(mental images constantly developing)p

[Replaced_Texan]

Originally posted by ThurgreedMarshall
Actually, I was thinking on another (lower) level.

Name the absolute worst behavior you've witnessed of (your own or) someone's else's kids that made you want to smack those little fuckers. I've found that when I want to smack the kids I want to smack the parents 10 times harder.

The child's name is Trae or Trey, I don't remember how it's spelled. He was three or four at the time that I first met him, I think he's six or seven now. My family has an annual party where friends and colleagues are invited to hang out, drink beer, eat a lot, and generally be merry. His mother is a professional colleague of my dad's, and it's one of those deals where you sort of have to invite them. Trey and his family showed up, and the first thing he did was uproot several small trees that my mother had just planted in the garden. When it was explained to him that it was NOT ok to uproot small trees, he continued to do it. At some point, my brother picked him up and escorted him to his mother.

As is the nature of small kids at parties, he managed to escape his mother, and his next victims were the dogs. First he started bugging my mother's dog, who at that time was pretty blind and deaf. He kept on poking her with a stick, and she finally snapped at the stick. Fortunately for the dog, another guest witnessed the whole thing and took the kid and the stick away from the area of the dog, and the dog was put on a sympathetic lap, where he couldn't get to her any more.

My sister's dog at the time was still in gun school, and he had his training collar on because he could get a little wild. It was late in the evening, and he was exhausted from chasing sticks and eating all sorts of food he wasn't supposed to. My sister had patiently explained that the remote to Holden's training collar was only to be used by her, and never without reason. First, Trey started doing the stick poking thing to Holden, who was much quicker to respond than my mom's dog. When my sister, who hadn't seen what was going on, heard the barking, she immediaetly got the remote to his shock collar, and gave a warning shock to Holden. Trey LOVED the reaction to the shock collar, and distracted my sister, got a hold of the remote and started shocking Holden. He would press down on the button and not let go. To this day I think my sister is prepared to skin that child alive. My brother ended up grabbing the remote to the shock collar and forcibly handed the kid to his mother, who was oblivious to the whole thing.

Last time I saw the kid was year or two later, where he was whacking trees with sticks. Holden was older and wiser than the kid, and a friend of mine who had no idea about the earlier incident remarked that she'd never seen a dog look so much smarter than a kid before. The crowning moment was when the kid started whacking the windchimes with a stick, annoying everyone, and one of the windchimes whacked him in the face on the upswing.

[NotFromHere]

Originally posted by ThurgreedMarshall
You are reading the wrong thing into the comment. They are actually saying, "in relation to my current life experience, life before having kids was meaningless." They are only trying to stress to you how meaningful their kids are to them. It's called hyperbole.

Here, let's use an analogy to help you understand: "Once I found that perfect little handbag, I realized my entire life without it had been meaningless."

TM

If you were the teacher and she was the lawyer, would you stay home?

[Bad_Rich_Chic]

Originally posted by purse junkie
My tendency has been to offer a simple, unapologetic "I'm not." People then react one of two ways: (1) "you hate all kids, you monstrous unwomanly unnatural freak" or (2) "of course you will I didn't realize until I had them that my life was utterly empty and meaningless before".

This pisses me off then because (1) while I may or may not (and may certainly find your own kids unbearable), it doesn't lessen my essential decency as a person, and either way I'd never be rude enough to say so and (2) while your life may be a miserable useless pile of crap without kids, mine is actually pretty damn great. But there's no way to convince people without acting like I'm justifying my actions, which I won't do for some graceless idiot.

Dammit, Leagaleze, this is like the third time I've had the system automatically log me out while I'm typing a reply, and then, upon logging back in, it doesn't retain my response and it's all lost. Help?

The substance of my post:

I know parents who hate all children. they don't admit it either, but it is obvious.

Yes, those responses are of course rude responses, as are others that are routinely sanctioned (you should keep your options open, shouldn't make that decision yet, etc.). Somehow, the notion that telling childless couples that they'll regret it isn't recognized as being just as rude as telling current or expecting parents that they'll regret it.

Miscellaneous suggestions for responses to parents castigating the childless: Turn-about is usually a good method for rudeness, but, as notd above, the turn about "you have children? Well, you'll regret it; you can't understand the satisfaction of controlling your own life when you're enslaved to another being's needs, and besides they'll abandon you to die old, sick and alone in a nursing home while they wait to get your money," while basically the same comment as you have gotten, hits too many sacred cows to make the point. Saying "Well," cut eyes to offender's children, "we'll just have to agree to disagree" passes. Saying "Oh, I'm sure we'll manage to find satisfaction somehow" while softly brushing invisible lint off of your spouse's sleeve is just cruel. Fair but cruel.

General defense to intrusive comments: puffing up like a pigeon and saying "I BEG your pardon," and then saying, if they stupidly ask the question again "I'm sure I never discuss such personal matters casually" tends to clinch it, though you will be thought to have a stick up your ass. People underestimate the benefits of being thought to have a stick up your ass; it insulates one from so many of life's little barbarities.

BR(insert anal fetish joke here)S

[tmdiva]

Caligula Clerk was a Penske sock? Well, that explains a lot.

As for retrograde ejaculation, it is a real phenomenon. Mostly it occurs in guys versed in the ways of tantric sex, but it can happen in the untrained as well. The tantric folks say that by not ejaculating they're retaining their chi, but the ejaculate probably just ends up in the bladder and pissed out anyway.

tm

P.S. Raauouauaoul, you're so full of shit.

[ThrashersFan]

Originally posted by former gov't
If you feel the need to comment during a game at least look up the basics -hooking or offsides.

former (5 for fighting) gov't

Or simply limit your comments to "kick his fucking ass!" and "where is that fucking beer man?"

Thrashers(wasn't raised to sit still and be quiet at hockey)Fan:cheers:

Originally posted by Mmmm, Burger (C.J.)
If you know some fucking paparazzi is going to stalk you for three weeks to get "exclusive" shots of your kid, and make all the money themselves, you might as well whore yourself out by eliminating the middleman and collect the dough yourself. That's why they sued over the wedding pics -- because otherwise their own market was ruined.

Pathetic for billionaires, buy they've been driven to it by the insatiable appetite of soccer moms bored in teh checkout line for such crap.

This is probably a stupid question but why does the fact that some people are authorized to take the pics prevent the paparazzit from getting different and potentially more embarrassing photos- which is what we really want to see?

Edited to add that I think this stalkarazzi thing makes more sense on the baby level and not the wedding level which is a one time event. However, I am not sure why the stalkarazzi wouldnt still go for it just bc the Star has some pics of the little gekko wrapped up in towels. ANd why does CZJ have to do these stypid commercials? I am guessing she gets nachos in the prenup and divorce is not an impossibility

[ThurgreedMarshall]

Originally posted by NotFromHere If you were the teacher and she was the lawyer, would you stay home?

Absofuckinglutely. All day with my kid? No bullshit at the office? Yez. We've had this discussion. Hard at first, but it gets better every day (or so I'm told).

TM

[evenodds]

Originally posted by NotFromHere
If you were the teacher and she was the lawyer, would you stay home?

I can answer that (for us, not him).

I have several women friends (corporate executives, lawyers) whose husbands no longer work, or work on "projects" rather than jobs. The husbands were successful in their careers, but as a couple they made the decision to focus on the wife's career rather than the husband's.

Some raise the children, but some are childless and prefer to have one of them available for travel or entertaining or just plain family life, which they felt is not possible with both as high-powered execs. One couple has a floating "sabbatical" structure where one can take a year off, or more (my personal favorite).

Even(the OM has agreed to stay home if/when we have the OddKids)Odds

[dtb]

Originally posted by sebastian_dangerfield
Women who croon about how childless women are missing out on life are usually pathetic soccer mom types. The best answer for these idiots is "Well, you should see what you're missing not having a career or interest". That usually shuts em up.

I generally don't even address housewives in conversation - they never have shit to say, despite having all day to read or develop an interest.

S(I have no respect for full time mommies who think their little darlings are the alpha and omega - if you've never been anything but a housemom, you might as well have been born a breeding mare)D

This is perhaps the most ignorant thing I've ever seen you say (and that's saying something!) I'm not saying that women with lots of time on their hands (armies of babysitters and no work outside the home) can be dullards -- in fact, I agree that most of them are. I had much first-hand experience with lots of them when I was on maternity leave.

However, you try staying home (without babysitting help) with a child (or two, or three) all day, and you'll be so grateful you have a job to go to, I wager the complaining-about-his-job, crotchety SD would disappear forever.

Raising children is real work. A lot harder than sitting behind a desk all day, that's for sure. Anyone who can spout off such ignorance clearly has never cared for a child. From the tenor of your attitude, I'm sure that after two days of looking after a child you cared about, you'd be begging to go back to your miserable job.

d(And I have no respect for "full-time mommies" (what kind of bullshit label is that? If you're a mother, you are by definition a full-time mommy) who don't have pride in their children -- what, you'd rather they be ashamed of them?)tb

[sebastian_dangerfield]

Originally posted by ThurgreedMarshall
It is stupid to think that a stay-at-home mother doesn't have opinions, interests and goals. It is stupid to think that goals can only be as you define them.

My wife was a teacher and will most likely go back to being one at some point, but right now she is at home with the kid. She is intelligent, opinionated, interesting and goal oriented. One of her goals is to raise our children the way we would like them to be raised. Not to hire someone to raise them their way.

I know you're probably over-generalizing (and you'll say you're doing it to make a point) and have carved out an exception for certain women who stay at home, but it sure doesn't seem that way. It seems like you're taking the shallowest of views on this topic.

TM

TM,

You're right - there is an exception. If a woman has worked and quits work to raise kids for a while, there's nothing wrong with that. She has her opinions, goals, etc. My problem is the husband-hunters who never work at anything real, get hitched, start pumping out kids and spend their lives between soccer practice, the nail salon, and the home. So yes, there is a carve-out, and yes, I painted with too broad a brush. that's part of the problem with this limited medium...

S(only so mch time to type)D

Originally posted by Replaced_Texan
[story of hell-child named Trae, Trey, Tray, or Tres]

1. I'd fantasize about ways I could throttle that little fucker. Quietly. With nobody looking.

2. I'd explain everything to the parents (except my desire to throttle, of course), and tell them either to get a baby sitter or not come to futire parties. I've used this approach with family without guilt.

K(of course, we have not talked to this person in about 2 years, but I don't consider it a loss)E

Originally posted by ThurgreedMarshall
Absofuckinglutely. All day with my kid? No bullshit at the office? Yez. We've had this discussion. Hard at first, but it gets better every day (or so I'm told).

TM

What would you do without *us*?

[dtb]

Originally posted by purse junkie
No, this is only when they say it to me--"once I had kids I realized my entire life without them had been meaningless." I think that's tragic! Even if they love having kids now, I think it's horrible if their lives were 'meaningless' before--I certainly don't feel that way about mine.

They probably didn't feel that about theirs either; it's only in retrospect.

However, I couldn't agree more that such officious lecturing is, uh, slightly offputting.

[ThurgreedMarshall]

Originally posted by sebastian_dangerfield
TM,

You're right - there is an exception. If a woman has worked and quits work to raise kids for a while, there's nothing wrong with that. She has her opinions, goals, etc. My problem is the husband-hunters who never work at anything real, get hitched, start pumping out kids and spend their lives between soccer practice, the nail salon, and the home. So yes, there is a carve-out, and yes, I painted with too broad a brush. that's part of the problem with this limited medium...

I think you're still missing it.

The problem is that you're too quick to lump women who choose to stay home with their children as uninteresting, with their only goal being finding a husband and staying home with the kids. While there are women out there who know from day 1 that they want to stay home and raise their children (and I don't see anything wrong with that -- I think it's admirable and requires patience and sacrifice), there are also former career driven women who have decided after spending some time at home with their kid that they don't want to go back. No shame in either of those.

And I bet there are more housewives out there who are very interesting (in your sense of the word) who can more than hold their own against most career women, including those who can only talk about their pathetic fucking existence at work and how they can't find a date. You just wouldn't know, because as soon as they say one thing about staying at home or their kid, you shut off your brain.

TM