Politics As Usual

[Not Me]

Originally posted by Skeks in the city And we'd have had more money and troops to use against REAL terrorist threats, like Iran, Pakistan and Afganistan.

The flaw in your reasoning is that as fast as we kill them, new ones are being born. Unless we do something to fundamentally change the middle east, we are doomed to an endless war against muslim terrorists. Using our troops against terrorists won't work in the long term if that is all we do. The only thing that will work is to secularize and democratize the middle east along with deconcentrating the wealth in that region. This is what we are doing in Iraq and it is the only hope for the war on terrorism.

Bullets and bombs won't work as a long term strategy. Liberty, secularization, women's rights, and a viable middle class will work (althougth this may take short term bullets and bombs to accomplish). I don't know if we can achieve that, but we have to at least try or we are doomed to more 9/11's.

It is so short sighted of you to focus on using bullets and bombs to kill terrorists. For each one we kill, 50 or more muslim women are giving birth to a newborn terrorists.

I know that Ty likes to chime in about how if we are doing this in Iraq, then we should then be doing this everywhere, but we don't have the resources to do it everywhere. We have no other choice than to do it one step at a time because we don't have the ability to do it any other way.

After 9/11, the middle east terrorist mills have to be shut down. But how? By bombing Saudi Arabia? Not as long as Hello and his buddies want cheap gas for their SUVs. Iraq was the only viable option. If we can start the process of democratization in Iraq, there is hope. We also have to reduce our demand for foreign oil so that our dependence on the middle eastern totalitarian regimes like SA won't interfere with the war on terrorism.

[the Spartan]

Originally posted by Tyrone Slothrop
Doomed-a is-a your soul, and damned-a is-a your life.

Yr pal,

John Ya-ya

[It's] Lord John Worfin. If there's one thing I hate, it's to be mistaken for somebody else. Oh and by the by, shut up Ty, you coward. You are the weakest individual I ever know.

I'LL SEE YOU IN HELL,
Lord John Whorfin

[Secret_Agent_Man]

Originally posted by Not Me
Seriously, though, one of the panel members on Fox News Sunday, I think it was Paul Gigot, said it best - you cannot hold the Prez to a "beyond a reasonable doubt" standard about these things before he acts after the US has been attacked by a foreign entity.

Ok. How about a "Don't fuck it up" standard?

P.S. You should not pretend anymore that this is about a direct response to 9/11 or about directly fighting al Qaeda.

As you have so often reiterated, the justification for the War which remains is the whole "reorganize the world to make it better" approach. Whether or not the Iraq effort will do so, or would have done so if handled though other than Neo-con/Achmed Chalabi blinders, is very much open to dispute -- which is why many of your conservative friends -- such as Club -- are working so damn hard to find other justifications.

Remember, the high-ranking Iraqi al Qaeda members are all hiding in Syria, sitting on top of the WMD. Go get 'em!

Excertps from Club's article:


"We are now in the process of getting this latest intelligence," Lehman said.


Commission Chairman Thomas Kean urged the administration to make any such information available to the panel quickly.


* * *

He said the final report would be modified to take any new intelligence into account.


Lehman said the information, contained in "captured documents," was obtained after the commission report was written that stated there was no evidence of a "collaborative relationship" between Iraq and al Qaeda.

* * *

"That still has to be confirmed, but the vice president (Dick Cheney (news - web sites)) was right when he said that he may have things that we don't yet have," said Lehman, a former Navy secretary.

* * *

Lehman said there was no evidence Saddam was involved in the Sept. 11, 2001, attacks on America. But he said the recent information about the Fedayeen officer "demonstrates the difficulty that we've had in this commission."


"We're under tremendous political pressures -- everything we come out with, one side or the other seizes on in this election year," Lehman said."


So, the Administration is releasing this intelligence now, Hmmm? Political motive? I wonder if it comes from Cheney's friends at the INC?

S_A_M

[the Spartan]

Who becomes contrite most?

Bill Clinton loses his temper with David Dimbleby during a BBC television interview to be broadcast this week when he is repeatedly quizzed about his affair with Monica Lewinsky.

Chairman Me-so Contrite and his Gang of Four:

[sgtclub]

http://apnews.myway.com/article/20040621/D83BF3B81.html

[Iran captures 3 UK navy ships]

[Did you just call me Coltrane?]

Originally posted by sgtclub
http://apnews.myway.com/article/20040621/D83BF3B81.html

[Iran captures 3 UK navy ships]

This is easy.

Attack North Korea.

[Tyrone Slothrop]

Originally posted by the Spartan

Wonderful composition!

[the Spartan]

Originally posted by Tyrone Slothrop
Wonderful composition!

Thanks. My photoshoppe skillz are mad crazzy these days. Boo-ya!

FWIW, and this outable, but what the fvck, that is me in the black suit and open collar shirt in the top right hand corner of the pic. I'm a double-agent. iykwim.

[The Larry Davis Experience]

Originally posted by Say_hello_for_me
Have a beer or glass of wine tonight, and raise it in toast to this great nation. Despite at least a few losses of life in Saudi Arabia and Iraq, this weekend has been filled with good news.

The head of Al Queda in SA was killed alongside his deputy. Cheers.

The head of an Al Queda affiliated branch in Algeria was killed, along with 4 deputies. Cheers.

A prominent Pakistani tribesmen who offered significant support to Al Queda and Taliban members was killed, along with several deputies. Cheers.

ETA: Is our intelligence getting better suddenly?

It is pretty sudden, isn't it.

I saw these stories over the weekend too. I find it rather impressive that the SA authorities would make such a dramatic announcement so soon after Johnson was killed by his captors, despite the fact that they have been mostly notable for their foot dragging up until now. While I understand your "score one for the good guys" viewpoint, I guess I have a certain skepticism of foriegn claims of success in the war on terror, based on stories like this one regarding the Macedonian govt's scheme to get on our good side by killing Pakistanis who they said were AQ operatives. As we all know SA has a big interest in playing ball with us, with our friendship with them being attacked from more mainstream sources nowadays. It's pretty easy for me to believe a similar motive might be behind this announcement as well.

I guess I can't be skeptical of all these stories though. Some of these people have to be who we think they are, right?

[Greedy,Greedy,Greedy]

An email just received from Amazon:

Order President Bill Clinton's My Life today and save 40%! The long-awaited memoir is the most candid, nuanced account of a presidency ever written. Visit our special features page to order your copy and listen to a few words from the man himself.

[Shape Shifter]

Originally posted by The Larry Davis Experience
It is pretty sudden, isn't it.

I saw these stories over the weekend too. I find it rather impressive that the SA authorities would make such a dramatic announcement so soon after Johnson was killed by his captors, despite the fact that they have been mostly notable for their foot dragging up until now. While I understand your "score one for the good guys" viewpoint, I guess I have a certain skepticism of foriegn claims of success in the war on terror, based on stories like this one regarding the Macedonian govt's scheme to get on our good side by killing Pakistanis who they said were AQ operatives. As we all know SA has a big interest in playing ball with us, with our friendship with them being attacked from more mainstream sources nowadays. It's pretty easy for me to believe a similar motive might be behind this announcement as well.

I guess I can't be skeptical of all these stories though. Some of these people have to be who we think they are, right?

It would be nice for the Saudis to bring a couple in alive (or not behead them almost immediately after bringing them in alive) so that we could interrogate them.

[Secret_Agent_Man]

Originally posted by sgtclub
http://apnews.myway.com/article/20040621/D83BF3B81.html

[Iran captures 3 UK navy ships]

I'd do exactly what I expect the adminsitration IS doing right now - telling the Iranians quietly and politely that they'd better let the ships and crew go right now. If they don't we begin to move some troops and ships around in Iraq and the Gulf waters.

This sort of stuff happens -- we killed some Iranians by accident in the war. But they'll let them go.

S_A_M

[Hank Chinaski]

Originally posted by Shape Shifter
It would be nice for the Saudis to bring a couple in alive (or not behead them almost immediately after bringing them in alive) so that we could interrogate them.

you know in Faherhite 431 whee the guy sees the helicopter chasing and killing him on TV? That's sort of how this struck me.

[Tyrone Slothrop]

Posted on Political Animal
Yesterday I was wondering why Vladimir Putin wants George Bush to be reelected. Here's one analyst's answer:

• "It's apparent that Russians and President Putin are interested in a second term for Bush," said Liliya Shevtsova of the Carnegie Moscow Center. "We've always had good relations with Republicans. We dislike Democrats, because Democrats always care about democracy in Russia."

Yeah, Democrats can be annoying that way. It's much easier to deal with Republicans who occasionally jabber about democracy but never actually do anything about it, isn't it?

[Hank Chinaski]

Originally posted by Tyrone Slothrop
Yeah, Democrats can be annoying that way. It's much easier to deal with Republicans who occasionally jabber about democracy but never actually do anything about it, isn't it?

You've got us there Ty. The dems have taken positive steps to show how democracy can benefits the non-free governments. Example:
Billy showed the Red chinese how a little political $$$ can be used to obtain complex missile technology.