Politics: Onward from New Hampshire

[Not Me]

Originally posted by Tyrone_Slothrop
I am tempted to explain why you are wrong, but this has to be one of the silliest debates ever on this board. So I will just say that it's not easy to make up really good shit

Whiff. The point is really good shit in whose eyes?

If the non-science/math prof likes ass kissers and you kiss his ass, then he will be more likely to think your paper is really good shit and you get the A.

If the science/math prof likes ass kissers and you kiss his ass, it doesn't matter because he cannot give you an A unless you get the answers right on the test. See the answers aren't made up, they are either right or wrong based on the laws of physics or chemistry or biology.

Originally posted by Tyrone_Slothrop
even if Hank's posts make it look effortless. People don't see the long hours he puts in, refining his material until even the spelling mistakes are just so.

I think Hank is your sock.

[Tyrone Slothrop]

Originally posted by Not Me
Whiff.

We don't say "whiff" on this board. We accuse each other of being partisan.

I think Hank is your sock.

Curses, the jig is up. OK, you won't see Hank any more, but keep your eyes out for a new sock.

[Not Me]

Originally posted by sgtclub
Yes, but the question is whether something short of that restrictive standard be actionable?

I don't think that it is all that hard to figure out where the line is.

Give me specific examples of things that people might want to say and I will tell you yes or no regarding whether it is actionable. And I think you can, too. The shock jocks know, too. For instance, graphic descriptions of people beating off to porno - actionable if broadcast on the public airwaves. That guy knew that before he did that schtick. He just thought the FCC wouldn't do anything about it because they haven't been aggressive about this kind of stuff in the past.

Originally posted by sgtclub
I was referring to the slippery slope.

I know but comparing the FCC to Nazis is over the top. If the FCC gets heavy handed and starts enforcing the regulations for less egregious offenses, people like me (who are OK with censoring graphic descriptions of people beating off) will call on Congress to reign in the FCC.

The fact that the German people were unwilling to do anything to stop the Nazis really isn't analogous to this situation. The German people were quite an anti-semetic bunch and not only didn't do anything to stop the horrors, quite frankly, they didn't see what was going on as a horror. If the FCC gets heavy handed, people like me will be unhappy about that. We don't want to see the FCC micromanaging programming. We just think it is reasonable to put some boundaries on speech when it is carried over the public airwaves.

The FCC licenses are not a right; they are a privilege - just like a driver's license. Getting a license to drive on public streets is analogous to broadcasting on the public airwaves. In neither instance do you have an unfettered right to do whatever you want on these publicly owned venues. For instance, while Congress may not be able to prevent you from having a telephone conversation in your home, they can prevent you from having one while driving.

Originally posted by sgtclub
You are ill-informed.

Cite please.

[Not Me]

Originally posted by Tyrone_Slothrop
We don't say "whiff" on this board. We accuse each other of being partisan.

OK but are science majors the Reps or the Dems?

Originally posted by Tyrone_Slothrop
Curses, the jig is up. OK, you won't see Hank any more, but keep your eyes out for a new sock.

You're not ready to give him up. I wish you would change his avatar, though. That guy in the pic creeps me out.

[Shape Shifter]

Originally posted by Not Me
OK but are science majors the Reps or the Dems?

If they're all foreigners, does it really matter?

[Tyrone Slothrop]

Originally posted by Not Me
The fact that the German people were unwilling to do anything to stop the Nazis really isn't analogous to this situation.

I guess it takes a humanities major to point out that this was wrong. Hitler was elected to power. The Communists and Socialists were armed, and were waiting to oppose a coup, but there was no occasion for them to mobilize. Even years later, the military was ready to stage a coup -- notably, they approached Lord Chamberlain before Munich to tell him to stand firm, and planned a coup to avoid a war with Czechoslovakia, but Chamberlain had other ideas.

The German people were quite an anti-semetic bunch and not only didn't do anything to stop the horrors, quite frankly, they didn't see what was going on as a horror.

Not this crap again. I guess this tripe is what you get when a physics major tries to write history.

If you want to read a more sophisticated account of what some Germans were thinking and doing during the war, read Heisenberg's War, an account of the German atom program. The physics in it might help you get through it.

[bilmore]

Originally posted by Not Me
Some of the biggest racists live in the Northeast.

Healthier diet.

Damn. Beat out by Ty.

Ha! -- T.S.

[Hank Chinaski]

Originally posted by Tyrone_Slothrop
I am tempted to explain why you are wrong, but this has to be one of the silliest debates ever on this board. So I will just say that it's not easy to make up really good shit, even if Hank's posts make it look effortless. People don't see the long hours he puts in, refining his material until even the spelling mistakes are just so.

I can't imagine how I got dragged into this.

I did think of this point, though, in some ways science/engineering majors are "cowardly."

A lot of people pick those majors, not because they're interested in building bridges, but because its more likely there will be a job at the end of the degree.

And not me, if you went to a top flight, really really good college, your liberal arts classes would have good profs who don't give As away.

[pretermitted_child]

Originally posted by Hank Chinaski
I did think of this point, though, in some ways science/engineering majors are "cowardly."

A lot of people pick those majors, not because they're interested in building bridges, but because its more likely there will be a job at the end of the degree.

Very true. At my undergrad school, the ratio of EE/CS-majors to physics majors was about 7:1. Majoring in physics -- at my school, at least -- was widely believed to be useful only for applying to grad school, rather than getting a job after graduation.

p(I went with the EE/CS department because they had all the fun labs -- you didn't have lab classes in the physics department that would let you implement Tetris on a tall building, for example. Nor would you have as many opportunities to blow up an infinite variety of integrated circuits. Good times.)c

[Not Me]

Originally posted by Hank Chinaski
I did think of this point, though, in some ways science/engineering majors are "cowardly."

A lot of people pick those majors, not because they're interested in building bridges, but because its more likely there will be a job at the end of the degree.

Sure if by cowardly you mean smart.

Originally posted by Hank Chinaski
And not me, if you went to a top flight, really really good college, your liberal arts classes would have good profs who don't give As away.

First of all, where I went to school, the humanities profs did curve their classes. The curve-no curve thing was brought into this discussion to address Ty's remarks that grades don't reflect intrinsic merit. In a science/math class where there is a right and a wrong answer and the number of A's is limited to a set percentage, grades do in fact reflect intrinsic merit.

Second, whiff. It isn't an issue of how many A's are given. It is an issue of how the prof's determine who gets an A or not. In the non-science/non-math classes, it is simply up to the prof's own subjective standards of what is good made up shit vs. what is bad made up shit. Even at a great college. The same paper expounding on the imagery of the ant fight in Walden Pond might be good to one prof at a top school and not so good to another at the same school. The same paper can get different grades by two profs at the same top school.

And you have got to be kidding me if you are suggesting that prof's at top schools aren't subject to manipulation of their egos by students. They are more susceptible to it.

[Not Me]

Originally posted by Tyrone_Slothrop
The Communists and Socialists were armed, and were waiting to oppose a coup, but there was no occasion for them to mobilize. Even years later, the military was ready to stage a coup -- notably, they approached Lord Chamberlain before Munich to tell him to stand firm, and planned a coup to avoid a war with Czechoslovakia, but Chamberlain had other ideas.

But that wasn't to save the jews. It was because they wanted to be the ones in power and they disagreed with the war.

Originally posted by Tyrone_Slothrop
Not this crap again. I guess this tripe is what you get when a physics major tries to write history.

The German people and many in eastern Europe at the time of WWII were very anti-semetic. There are many people in that part of the world who couldn't have cared less that the jews were being killed and were happy to take all their stuff when they were shipped off on those trains. Regular people. Their neighbors and business associates.

You are uniformed if you think that the anti-semitism of that region of the world wasn't wide spread in the citizenry. It didn't go away after the war, either. The mass exodus of jews from europe to the US and what was to be Israel was because of the wide spread anti-semitism.

You need to read a book on the birth of Israel written by those who lived in Europe at that time.

Let me guess. Next you will tell me all those Russian jews immigrating to Israel to escape anti-semitism are just being cry babies.

[Tyrone Slothrop]

Originally posted by Not Me
The curve-no curve thing was brought into this discussion to address Ty's remarks that grades don't reflect intrinsic merit. In a science/math class where there is a right and a wrong answer and the number of A's is limited to a set percentage, grades do in fact reflect intrinsic merit.

If Professor A asks easy questions and Professor B asks tough questions, a B in Professor B's class may mean more than an A- in Professor A's class. Even if it's the same curriculum at the same school. You were doing better when you stuck to fulminating from 30,000 foot. Also, posting dumb things about the rise of Nazis undercuts your argument.

[Tyrone Slothrop]

Originally posted by Not Me
But that wasn't to save the jews. It was because they wanted to be the ones in power and they disagreed with the war.

Who anticipated the Holocaust in 1930?

The German people and many in eastern Europe at the time of WWII were very anti-semetic. There are many people in that part of the world who couldn't have cared less that the jews were being killed and were happy to take all their stuff when they were shipped off on those trains. Regular people. Their neighbors and business associates.

You are uniformed if you think that the anti-semitism of that region of the world wasn't wide spread in the citizenry.

Let me guess. Next you will tell me all those Russian jews immigrating to Israel to escape anti-semitism are just being cry babies.

You are painting a house, and are using a thicker brush than you would use if you were trying to paint a portrait, where detail matters. Whatever -- just slop it on.

[Not Me]

Originally posted by Tyrone_Slothrop
If Professor A asks easy questions and Professor B asks tough questions, a B in Professor B's class may mean more than an A- in Professor A's class. Even if it's the same curriculum at the same school.

Now you are contradicting your prior post. Go back and reread your prior post and try to reconcile what you said before with what you are saying now. If you can.

Originally posted by Tyrone_Slothrop
Also, posting dumb things about the rise of Nazis undercuts your argument.

Who was talking about the rise of the Nazis? I was talking about why it was that the german people didn't care what the Nazis were doing to the jews. I am well aware of the fact that the nazis weren't the only party vying for power in germany. That wasn't the issue. The issue is whether the majority of germans gave a damn about what the nazis were doing to the jews.

[Tyrone Slothrop]

Originally posted by Not Me
Now you are contradicting your prior post. Go back and reread your prior post and try to reconcile what you said before with what you are saying now. If you can.

It's a stupid argument, and only the more stupid if you're playing these games. I don't care. You're right about all of it.

Who was talking about the rise of the Nazis? I was talking about why it was that the german people didn't care what the Nazis were doing to the jews. I am well aware of the fact that the nazis weren't the only party vying for power in germany. That wasn't the issue. The issue is whether the majority of germans gave a damn about what the nazis were doing to the jews.

You said "that the German people were unwilling to do anything to stop the Nazis." I pointed out that the left wing was armed and ready to stop Hitler's rise to power, but was waiting for a coup that never came. You may have missed that I was talking about the early 1930s. I also mentioned that the military planned a coup before Munich. The military tried again, and Hitler escaped an attempt on his life in 1944 through impressive luck. So, to the extent that you were saying anything other than that Germans were anti-Semitic, you were wrong. I choose not to argue with you on your larger point.