Still Hating America.

[taxwonk]

Originally posted by andViolins
No. I'm only suggesting that a lot of people have no idea what they are talking about when they state that electronic data has been erased or lost.

aV

So, then it wouldn't really be fair to expect a big organization like, say, the White House, with a greater than usual interest in the security of its communications and a greater than usual duty to preserve and maintain those communications to be up on this sort of thing? You know, institutionally speaking.

[Tyrone Slothrop]

Originally posted by taxwonk
So, then it wouldn't really be fair to expect a big organization like, say, the White House, with a greater than usual interest in the security of its communications and a greater than usual duty to preserve and maintain those communications to be up on this sort of thing? You know, institutionally speaking.

More here.

The official "policy" about document retention reminds me of Bush's vow to fire whoever had been leaking.

[Mmmm, Burger (C.J.)]

Originally posted by Tyrone Slothrop


How about that?

I think this is going to rise to about the level that having Al Gore make fundraising calls from the white house did.

I have several email accounts, one for work, which are accessible from my computer. I am obligated to preserve the work email pursuant to employer policy. My personal email, which I keep separate, is on my own policy. While I try to do it well, it is not hard accidentally to send a work email using my personal account. If I don't happen to notice it, well then it will be deleted per my settings not my employer's (that is, empty sent items after 30 days).

For the WH, it's quite clear having the RNC emails was not only legitimate, it was essentially required for pursposes of the Hatch Act. Indeed, the Clinton admin. did the same.

Does that mean it wasn't abused? Who knows. But it seems a reach to say just because a few emails went to/from the wrong account, it's a conspiracy to avoid the white house email retention system.

[Mmmm, Burger (C.J.)]

Originally posted by taxwonk
Would that suggest that the White House might be beig less than honest when it claims the emails were lost? I'm curious because this sort of question tends to come up a lot and I want to be clear.

If it's not sent through a white house server, why would the white house retain it? It's the RNC's server, over which the WH presumably does not have control, and for which the retention requirements, and therefore the retention settings, are likely quite different.

[Shape Shifter]

Originally posted by Mmmm, Burger (C.J.)
If it's not sent through a white house server, why would the white house retain it? It's the RNC's server, over which the WH presumably does not have control, and for which the retention requirements, and therefore the retention settings, are likely quite different.

Doesn't the WH have control over the people who work there? What about the Presidential Records Act?

[Hank Chinaski]

Originally posted by Shape Shifter
Doesn't the WH have control over the people who work there? What about the Presidential Records Act?

do you think that extends to every document created by every employee? Sandy Berger would never have been able to find the stuff he needed to steal.

[andViolins]

Originally posted by Mmmm, Burger (C.J.)
If it's not sent through a white house server, why would the white house retain it? It's the RNC's server, over which the WH presumably does not have control, and for which the retention requirements, and therefore the retention settings, are likely quite different.

Couldn't the Senate then issue a subpoena for the RNC servers? Or, perhaps the fine folks at the RNC make periodic back up tapes of their servers. Why not issue a subpoena for those as well? If they can identify the specific White House staffers that were utilizing the RNC provided e-mail accounts, then issue a subpoena for their home computers and/or personal laptops.

aV

[Shape Shifter]

Originally posted by Hank Chinaski
do you think that extends to every document created by every employee? Sandy Berger would never have been able to find the stuff he needed to steal.

Sandy Berger pleaded guilty to a crime. Are you suggesting that Karl Rove do the same?

[Hank Chinaski]

Originally posted by Shape Shifter
Sandy Berger pleaded guilty to a crime. Are you suggesting that Karl Rove do the same?

Sounds like Rove won't have to steal bad documents from the Archives someday. They. Have. Been. Deleted.

let's move on.

[Mmmm, Burger (C.J.)]

Originally posted by Shape Shifter
Doesn't the WH have control over the people who work there?

You really think that's ever been the case?

[Mmmm, Burger (C.J.)]

Originally posted by andViolins
Couldn't the Senate then issue a subpoena for the RNC servers? Or, perhaps the fine folks at the RNC make periodic back up tapes of their servers. Why not issue a subpoena for those as well? If they can identify the specific White House staffers that were utilizing the RNC provided e-mail accounts, then issue a subpoena for their home computers and/or personal laptops.

aV

Sure, I would think they could. But we all know the importance of document retention policies.

[Hank Chinaski]

Originally posted by Mmmm, Burger (C.J.)
Sure, I would think they could. But we all know the importance of document retention policies.

how could WH document retention policy apply to document it doesn't have control over? suggested standards?

I think Bush needs to learn "so what." Like "What if there is global warming? So what?" or "Yes, we fired some Prosecutors because we didn't like how they followed political orders. So what?" it would just be simpler for him.

[Shape Shifter]

Originally posted by Hank Chinaski
Sounds like Rove won't have to steal bad documents from the Archives someday. They. Have. Been. Deleted.

let's move on.

So he broke the law. Let's not move on. Let's recover the files.

[andViolins]

Originally posted by Mmmm, Burger (C.J.)
Sure, I would think they could. But we all know the importance of document retention policies.

True. But we also know that computers don't save things in a very orderly fashion. Thus, depending on the size of the servers in question, it is highly unlikely that all of the "missing" e-mails have been "saved over" even if the e-mail program settings were deleting sent/trash items after 30/60/90 days.

aV

[Hank Chinaski]

Originally posted by Shape Shifter
So he broke the law. Let's not move on. Let's recover the files.

I thought you were researching the Presidential Records Act to show it applied to these emails?