General discussion - Mom and Dad Esq.

[Icky Thump]

Originally Posted by dtb

So a friend of my older son's was over (the friend is 9), and they were playing something or other with my little guy (who is 6). During some disagreement over the game or whatever they were playing, the guest called the little guy a "bitch".

Now, my kids are hardly model citizens, but one thing they don't do is say "bad words". I am reminded every day that I am not a perfect mother, but this is something I feel strongly about - that kids shouldn't say bad words. Would that I could follow my own advice, but I think it sounds especially vulgar and trashy when kids swear.

My question is -- do I mention this to the kid's parents? (Not to advocate any particular course of action w/r/t their kid, just to inform them -- because I'd certainly want to know if my kids were swearing out of my earshot.)

Just wait. Between 14 and 18 every other word out of their mouths (when they think you aren't around) will be cum, pussy, fuck and blow job.

And the boys are even worse.

[robustpuppy]

Originally Posted by Sidd Finch

It's not realistic to think that your kids won't curse, or hear bad language. I think it's important to start talking about context with them as soon as you can, so they understand that in some situations it's not okay for anyone to use certain words. So far, I've found that doing this -- acting like cursing is not the forbidden fruit, but just another thing that they need to be careful about -- Sidd Jr. doesn't get the illicit thrill from cursing that I did at his age, and doesn't want to do it so much. If he says a word to me, I won't get mad at him but will make sure he knows that what's okay to say to me in the car isn't okay to say in school or in front of his little sisters.

About the worst word he says with any frequency is "fart". On a recent vacation, in order to avoid having his sister learn that word (she 3, and would repeat it constantly), we renamed the word "cheeseburger." That way, we could be standing on line and say to each other "oof, it smells like someone is grilling cheeseburgers here!" Good times.

That is the cutest thing you've ever posted. And it cheered me up today.

[Atticus Grinch]

Originally Posted by robustpuppy

That is the cutest thing you've ever posted. And it cheered me up today.

OTOH, it will be a while before I'll be able to truly enjoy a cheeseburger again.

[Gattigap]

I can't remember how old I was, really. Probably 7 or 8 years old, I guess. But I do remember the nightmare. I remember waking up with a start, sitting up ramrod straight in bed and calling for my parents.

It must've been pretty late (or pretty early). My Dad came into my room, bleary eyed, and asked, What's the matter?

I had a nightmare, Dad. It was horrible.

What about?

I was stuck on railroad tracks, and I was trying to get away from a train.

And then what happened?

I kept trying to get away. I couldn't just walk off the tracks, I had to keep running on them. And it got closer, and closer. And CLOSER. It was going to run me over!

And then what happened?

Well ... I woke up! It was horrible.

With the benefit of perspective and time, I know that it was because it was late (or early), and my Dad was exhausted. That's most likely why he sighed and told me that what I described was a dumb nightmare as nightmares go, and I should get over it and go back to sleep. He got up, turned out the light, and left me in the dark to sort it out on my own.

I hated that. And I swore then and there with the kind of stone-cold certainty that only 7 year olds possess that when I was a father, by God I was going to listen to my son and give him more comfort than that, you asshole.

******

So I have a 9yo son. One who, as a younger child, seemed scared of his own shadow. It was a source of significant frustration back when the kid was a toddler. It's less of an issue these days, but sometimes even today the problem still rears its head.

This evening after the boys are to bed, I hear Daaaaad, DaaAAAAAaaaaad! from upstairs from the 9yo. Convinced that his calls will wake the 5yo Gaplet, I hustle upstairs to get him to stop.

What's the matter?

I'm having scary thoughts.

What about?

Gaplet then, over the course of about 5 minutes, starts to tell me a long, rambling and discursive story about the movie clip that he saw as a preview for another movie - one that lasted about 3 or 4 seconds, but had a scene with a kid about his age in bed who rolls over and sees a scary-looking monster dude in bed next to him to yells "Surprise!" all spooky-like and wow, it was scary, and I just can't get it out of my head!

I stifle the impulse to tell him to get over it and go back to sleep and think, Well, Gatti, this is your Teachable Moment.

So I take a deep breath, and talk it through with him. I explain how movies are made, that they're make-believe (which he, of course, knows.) I make up a story about how even thought the freaky monster dude looks horrible, he's probably a normal, nice guy who gets transformed after sitting in the makeup artist's chair for several hours, like with Gaplet's experiences in some theater productions. I make up a story about how the day they shot that scene, he probably had really bad gas and sat in the makeup chair and farted out the tune to Camptown Ladies - which I figured (correctly) would be a big hit with my 9yo. I got him laughing about it, and explained that this is what he could think about if the movie got stuck in his head again, and in any event it was time to go to bed. I turn out the lights and whistle a couple of bars to Camptown Ladies, to giggles from Gaplet.

I walk downstairs, thinking, nice job, Gatti. You sly devil, you.

10 minutes later. Daaaaaad. DaAAAAAAAAAaaaaad!

I hustle upstairs. Dad, Gaplet says, I can't shake this image, and can't get to sleep. What do I do?

I clasp my hand to stifle the strangling impulse and say, Look. I'll get Mom to come talk it through with you. Maybe she'll have some other ideas.

I walk downstairs and tell Ms. Gap, your turn. "Okay," says she.

She wanders upstairs, talks with Gaplet for a few minutes, and soon all lights are out. She comes downstairs.

So what'd you say?

"I told him to get over it."

WHAT? No, nonononono. That's supposed to be MY job, dammit.

"Huh uh. You're going to be the good cop."

Gattigap

[Atticus Grinch]

Originally Posted by Gattigap

[long story]

I just watched Mike Rowe bite the testicles off a sheep. Have you a valediction for me, boyo?

[Gattigap]

Originally Posted by Atticus Grinch

I just watched Mike Rowe bite the testicles off a sheep. Have you a valediction for me, boyo?

Sure. Get over the beastiality porn, son, or it'll get over you.

[J. Fred Muggs]

Originally Posted by dtb

So a friend of my older son's was over (the friend is 9), and they were playing something or other with my little guy (who is 6). During some disagreement over the game or whatever they were playing, the guest called the little guy a "bitch".

Now, my kids are hardly model citizens, but one thing they don't do is say "bad words". I am reminded every day that I am not a perfect mother, but this is something I feel strongly about - that kids shouldn't say bad words. Would that I could follow my own advice, but I think it sounds especially vulgar and trashy when kids swear.

My question is -- do I mention this to the kid's parents? (Not to advocate any particular course of action w/r/t their kid, just to inform them -- because I'd certainly want to know if my kids were swearing out of my earshot.)

I'd talk to the little asshole, but I'd also probably tell the parents in passing. My highly effective technique for making children too uncomfortable to swear around me is to feign confusion and ask why "bitch" is an insult. I regularly do that with kids who throw around "gay" or "fag" as an insult. Might not work so well in your small town, but in my supposedly enlightened part of the world, kids smarten up.

[Flinty_McFlint]

Originally Posted by J. Fred Muggs

I'd talk to the little asshole, but I'd also probably tell the parents in passing. My highly effective technique for making children too uncomfortable to swear around me is to feign confusion and ask why "bitch" is an insult. I regularly do that with kids who throw around "gay" or "fag" as an insult. Might not work so well in your small town, but in my supposedly enlightened part of the world, kids smarten up.

Something doesn't add up here. Since when do they let kids in your office?

[taxwonk]

Originally Posted by Sidd Finch

It's not realistic to think that your kids won't curse, or hear bad language. I think it's important to start talking about context with them as soon as you can, so they understand that in some situations it's not okay for anyone to use certain words. So far, I've found that doing this -- acting like cursing is not the forbidden fruit, but just another thing that they need to be careful about -- Sidd Jr. doesn't get the illicit thrill from cursing that I did at his age, and doesn't want to do it so much. If he says a word to me, I won't get mad at him but will make sure he knows that what's okay to say to me in the car isn't okay to say in school or in front of his little sisters.

About the worst word he says with any frequency is "fart". On a recent vacation, in order to avoid having his sister learn that word (she 3, and would repeat it constantly), we renamed the word "cheeseburger." That way, we could be standing on line and say to each other "oof, it smells like someone is grilling cheeseburgers here!" Good times.

The Monster is 12, and he currently gets a thrill out of calling me a fuckhead, dildo, or any of a variety of interesting names. He's sort of testing his independence. My father would have busted my jaw. I've slapped him on the back of the head a couple of times, but concluded that nothing short of a police-involvement level dull-scale beatdown would get him to stop.

So, I'm ignoring it. But, in 4 years, the little fucker will have a driver's license. I wonder who's going to be the fuckhead then.

[taxwonk]

Originally Posted by Flinty_McFlint

Something doesn't add up here. Since when do they let kids in your office?

I was going to ask when they started letting him see his own kids other than the court-supervised visits. Those don't really last long enough for much in-depth conversation.

[Mmmm, Burger (C.J.)]

Originally Posted by taxwonk

I've slapped him on the back of the head a couple of times, but concluded that nothing short of a police-involvement level dull-scale beatdown would get him to stop.

How about threatening to move to Nebraska?

[taxwonk]

Originally Posted by Mmmm, Burger (C.J.)

How about threatening to move to Nebraska?

Close. I've threatened to send him.

[Atticus Grinch]

One of my nieces is a high school sophomore. She's a little high-strung -- trust me, she comes by it honestly -- but otherwise seems like a totally normal kid. She's witty, a fast talker (it seems they all are at that age), and empathetic. Her parents are both pretty successful in their fields and can both be a little retentive, but their home life is comfortable and at the high-end range of functioning. She lives on the East Coast so we don't see her all the time, but when she talks about problems it seems like normal teen girl trauma -- school, bitchy friends, and more school.

So here's the thing -- we just found out that they're thinking of putting her on Xanax. Her mom says that some of her friends are already on it, and it has improved their outlook a great deal.

I'm outraged. Of course, I don't have complete insight into her day-to-day, but with the information that I know and putting it into the preexisting narrative of What I Think Is Wrong With America, this seems completely wrong to me.

I appreciate that there are real things called mood disorders and that some people need medication in order to do chemically what their brain cannot do organically. I get that. Depression and anxiety are real things.

But so is being a teenager. Let's assume that there's something going on here where she's struggling more than I've been led to know. Still, I'm gobsmacked that someone would even consider taking a teenager and attempting to treat symptoms without knowing whether she has a permanent condition that requires medication. Call me silly, but I thought these drugs were supposed to be prescribed when other approaches to a particular pathology had failed. I've go no objections at all to adults taking these drugs, because I trust that they would only do so as adults, figuring out that they needed to get past whatever was blocking their uptake of life's happiness. But a fucking teenager? If my kids are frustrated, anxious and unhappy at age 15 that's how I'll know they're growing up correctly. I didn't realize that adolescence, even in its extreme pathological form, was a condition requiring medication.

Am I being too, pardon the phrase, prescriptive here? Am I old-fashioned to think that pharmaceutical mood alteration is pretty serious stuff, and that even if she experiences a positive outcome there's still moral risk here?

[Icky Thump]

Originally Posted by Atticus Grinch

One of my nieces is a high school sophomore. She's a little high-strung -- trust me, she comes by it honestly -- but otherwise seems like a totally normal kid. She's witty, a fast talker (it seems they all are at that age), and empathetic. Her parents are both pretty successful in their fields and can both be a little retentive, but their home life is comfortable and at the high-end range of functioning. She lives on the East Coast so we don't see her all the time, but when she talks about problems it seems like normal teen girl trauma -- school, bitchy friends, and more school.

So here's the thing -- we just found out that they're thinking of putting her on Xanax. Her mom says that some of her friends are already on it, and it has improved their outlook a great deal.

I'm outraged. Of course, I don't have complete insight into her day-to-day, but with the information that I know and putting it into the preexisting narrative of What I Think Is Wrong With America, this seems completely wrong to me.

I appreciate that there are real things called mood disorders and that some people need medication in order to do chemically what their brain cannot do organically. I get that. Depression and anxiety are real things.

But so is being a teenager. Let's assume that there's something going on here where she's struggling more than I've been led to know. Still, I'm gobsmacked that someone would even consider taking a teenager and attempting to treat symptoms without knowing whether she has a permanent condition that requires medication. Call me silly, but I thought these drugs were supposed to be prescribed when other approaches to a particular pathology had failed. I've go no objections at all to adults taking these drugs, because I trust that they would only do so as adults, figuring out that they needed to get past whatever was blocking their uptake of life's happiness. But a fucking teenager? If my kids are frustrated, anxious and unhappy at age 15 that's how I'll know they're growing up correctly. I didn't realize that adolescence, even in its extreme pathological form, was a condition requiring medication.

Am I being too, pardon the phrase, prescriptive here? Am I old-fashioned to think that pharmaceutical mood alteration is pretty serious stuff, and that even if she experiences a positive outcome there's still moral risk here?

And people laugh at Scientology?

When the kindergarten teacher recommended Ritalin for icky Jr. I told the school I was a Scientologist and further comments would bring the full legal wrath of the church upon them.

[Hank Chinaski]

Originally Posted by Atticus Grinch

Am I old-fashioned to think that pharmaceutical mood alteration is pretty serious stuff, and that even if she experiences a positive outcome there's still moral risk here?

I haven't heard of a big push to drug teens. I saw it at the 1st and 2nd grade level. We did that chat here, one sock felt his kid really benefited. But I know some of my kids' friends got stuck on drugs where it made no sense (1 boy, who is the son of a neo-natoligist who is sort of introverted and spacey, was drugged for being introverted and spacey, etc.)

do you know if the initial push was from school, or if she went to a therapist for some other reason? I would tend to think less of a school initiated "suggestion" than one from an outside guy.

In the end, it's tough. I'm sure the parents are not pleased to have reached such a decision, and they have thought through everything you said.

At best, a simple, "I've heard from people with older kids that too many kids get meds prescribed now-a-days, are you really sure she needs this, she seems really normal," might be all you can say. If you want you can tell her you heard it from Hank Chinaski, then link her to my other parents' board posts so she understands the weight that she should place on the advice?