General discussion - Mom and Dad Esq.

[Gattigap]

Yeah. Shaddup, Atticus.

[Greedy,Greedy,Greedy]

Originally Posted by robustpuppy

And I would say that maybe you should reconsider your interference with your siblings' parenting decisions, too, but then I'd be peeing in a tent where my nose doesn't belong, or something like that.

I'm actually the least interfering of my sibs. I usually wait until the blood has stopped flowing and the combatants are exhausted, and then step in to provide balanced and sagacious advice when requested.

I also speak last at weddings, baptisms, bar mitzvahs, wakes and funerals.

Can a family member truly be a butowski? I mean, if all your family members held their tongue on some idiot thing your sister did, she'd still feel the cold shoulder somewhere, wouldn't she? I admire any family that can avoid it, but I haven't had the personal experience.

[Greedy,Greedy,Greedy]

Originally Posted by bold_n_brazen

Absent a request for input, I would smack either of my brothers who felt it was within their rights to interfere.

This would stop them?

Are you guys all wasps?

[robustpuppy]

Originally Posted by Greedy,Greedy,Greedy

I'm actually the least interfering of my sibs. I usually wait until the blood has stopped flowing and the combatants are exhausted, and then step in to provide balanced and sagacious advice when requested.

I also speak last at weddings, baptisms, bar mitzvahs, wakes and funerals.

Can a family member truly be a butowski? I mean, if all your family members held their tongue on some idiot thing your sister did, she'd still feel the cold shoulder somewhere, wouldn't she? I admire any family that can avoid it, but I haven't had the personal experience.

It's a regular passive-aggressive smorgasbord around here, isn't it? And just in time for the holiday season.

[robustpuppy]

Originally Posted by Gattigap

Yeah. Shaddup, Atticus.

So says the man who let his kid get into show business! What are you thinking? I would never do that to my kids. Even though they're gorgeous and talented.

[bold_n_brazen]

Originally Posted by Greedy,Greedy,Greedy

I'm actually the least interfering of my sibs. I usually wait until the blood has stopped flowing and the combatants are exhausted, and then step in to provide balanced and sagacious advice when requested.

I also speak last at weddings, baptisms, bar mitzvahs, wakes and funerals.

Can a family member truly be a butowski? I mean, if all your family members held their tongue on some idiot thing your sister did, she'd still feel the cold shoulder somewhere, wouldn't she? I admire any family that can avoid it, but I haven't had the personal experience.

Absent the belief that I am in danger, or am going to be a danger to someone else, my brothers would keep their mouths shut, especially about parenting decisions.

I do them the same courtesy.

But mostly, it's that I love them and trust them and know that they love their children.

[1436]

Originally Posted by Atticus Grinch

Yeah, I get that it's meddling. Family dynamics are such that everyone is allowed to judge one another without too many hurt feelings, because a sense of humor about oneself is prized above all else, but this particular sister is known to lash out over parenting issues in violation of the general rule. Chances I will say something to her are in the low zeroes. I just wanted to know if my emotional response to it was off-base, so I know which side of the family's whispering campaign I should join. I'm leaning toward the "What a terrible decision to face; I would have done the opposite" camp.

Your family is more polite than mine.

We get shit all the time for having one kid on a ton of drugs for her allergies. Because of the effectiveness of the drugs half the family doesn't think she has asthma or allergies. We tried to reduce the number of drugs, but it seems we are at a perfect balancing point and to pull even one pill from the cocktail send her into a coughing fit within 48 hours.

I know that is completely different from psychoactive drugs, but we had several doctors in the family tell us that she didn't need to be medicated at all before we went to the pediatrician. They just weren't there for the major attacks and she was a bit atypical in her reactions.

So whisper on whichever side you want. The real problem seems to be the mom telling you and then following up with statements that justify the decision based on peers. Some people aren't very good at understanding how others will feel about such justifications. you just have to trust that your kin, or their doctors, are a bit smarter than the average teenager.

[bold_n_brazen]

Originally Posted by Greedy,Greedy,Greedy

This would stop them?

Are you guys all wasps?

I'm fairly certain it wouldn't stop them, but it is certainly how I would react.

Only 2 people are currently entitled to weigh in on parenting decisions at present: the Brazenette's father and the Brazenette's soon-to-be-step-father.

At some point, I expect a future-as-yet-not-named-step-mother will also have weighing in rights.

[Gattigap]

Originally Posted by robustpuppy

So says the man who let his kid get into show business! What are you thinking? I would never do that to my kids. Even though they're gorgeous and talented.

Look, I needed a plausible entree into the easy sex and drugs coursing through the industry. I'm sure when he's old enough, he will both understand and forgive me.

[Atticus Grinch]

Originally Posted by robustpuppy

I say this with all affection for Atticus and with recognition that I frequently offer my own opinion where it's not wanted, but this is a parental decision and all other tongues should be held.

And I would say that maybe you should reconsider your interference with your siblings' parenting decisions, too, but then I'd be peeing in a tent where my nose doesn't belong, or something like that.

He doesn't live in their house or in the girl's head, and his niece's current situation is not about What Is Wrong With America but about what is going on in her life. That her other friends are on Xanax is irrelevant.

It's up to her parents to determine whether it's garden-variety teen angst or anxiety warranting treatment, and whether that treatment should be pharmaceutical or more "holistic." Moreover, children can and do have anxiety and depression that may respond to medication. It's no more normal for a child to have a mood disorder than it is for an adult. To say that high school is stressful is to say that life is stressful. If she were in her 20s and in law school, would you be so quick to chalk up whatever she's going through to academic stress? If in her 30s and at a law firm, job stress? In her 40s, sandwich-generation stress? In the nursing home, realizing that even at death's door, life is like high school stress?

Of course, if Atticus thought that their parenting judgment were severely compromised for some reason, such as drug or alcohol abuse or severe dysfunction in the home - which he stated is not the case - then he would have grounds to step in. But as to a mere difference of opinion and philosophy - no matter how strongly held those opinions are - well, it's just not his place.

Part of the problem is that the pro-Xanax folks didn't hold their tongues, but the anti-Xanax folks are seen as meddling when they offer a counterpoint. In that context, it will quickly become the new normal. A nuclear family is not an island, and I assume Sister shared this with us before it was a fait accompli because she needed help in the decision. I'm not convinced that the only kind of help that is appropriate to offer a family member is necessarily "support."

That said, your point that nearly every way of saying what I want to say will come off as an attack on her parenting is something I agree with 100%, which is why I never asked whether I should say something.

[Hank Chinaski]

Originally Posted by Atticus Grinch

Part of the problem is that the pro-Xanax folks didn't hold their tongues, but the anti-Xanax folks are seen as meddling when they offer a counterpoint. In that context, it will quickly become the new normal. A nuclear family is not an island, and I assume Sister shared this with us before it was a fait accompli because she needed help in the decision. I'm not convinced that the only kind of help that is appropriate to offer a family member is necessarily "support."

That said, your point that nearly every way of saying what I want to say will come off as an attack on her parenting is something I agree with 100%, which is why I never asked whether I should say something.

here's the thing, the hardest age for parenting is always the age where your oldest is at. you are breaking new ground, and the issues seem immense and too difficult to solve. Still, from my limited experience, a very tough time is a girl and her mother's relationship from about 14-19. It is a nightmare.

I had to say, several times, "ummmm, i kind of think K is right honey." never within earshot of K, but still. point is, it is easy to get going down a wrong course.

your sister is dealing with a child that is a cauldron of hormones, and someone with a diploma on his wall is telling her what she should do. it is hard to think for oneself in that situation.

that is why, my limited suggestion of simply asking a question, w/o offering any opinion is correct.

[Greedy,Greedy,Greedy]

Originally Posted by Hank Chinaski

here's the thing, the hardest age for parenting is always the age where your oldest is at. you are breaking new ground, and the issues seem immense and too difficult to solve. Still, from my limited experience, a very tough time is a girl and her mother's relationship from about 14-19. It is a nightmare.

I had to say, several times, "ummmm, i kind of think K is right honey." never within earshot of K, but still. point is, it is easy to get going down a wrong course.

your sister is dealing with a child that is a cauldron of hormones, and someone with a diploma on his wall is telling her what she should do. it is hard to think for oneself in that situation.

that is why, my limited suggestion of simply asking a question, w/o offering any opinion is correct.

A good point to note is that all the women on the board weighing in so far don't want any advice on childrearing from family members. It may be easier to give advice to the male part of the equation - we're more accustomed to being wrong.

I think you're right here, and that helping ask all the available questions is likely to be the best received input, and it is up to Atticus to figure out if she's asking for input or for help keeping the other relatives at bay.

[Atticus Grinch]

Originally Posted by Greedy,Greedy,Greedy

A good point to note is that all the women on the board weighing in so far don't want any advice on childrearing from family members. It may be easier to give advice to the male part of the equation - we're more accustomed to being wrong.

Unfortunately, you know the part where I said she was high-strung but came by it honestly? That would be because my BIL is a fucking dulcimer string. Nice guy, loves his family and takes good care of them, but he's the one who needs Xanax. At family events he's like a honeybee in the kitchen.

OTOH, he's rich as fuck by family standards -- they have a vacation home! -- so maybe I should take a lesson. We made him a godfather of one of our kids in the hope that maybe one of them could go to college.

[Hank Chinaski]

Originally Posted by Atticus Grinch

Unfortunately, you know the part where I said she was high-strung but came by it honestly? That would be because my BIL is a fucking dulcimer string. Nice guy, loves his family and takes good care of them, but he's the one who needs Xanax. At family events he's like a honeybee in the kitchen.

OTOH, he's rich as fuck by family standards -- they have a vacation home! -- so maybe I should take a lesson. We made him a godfather of one of our kids in the hope that maybe one of them could go to college.

if you want I'll call him. i had psychology in college....at Harvard.

[Atticus Grinch]

Originally Posted by Hank Chinaski

if you want I'll call him. i had psychology in college....at Harvard.

I hear half the people at PTO have psych ABs from Harvard.