Meet your new thread, same as the old thread.

[Not Bob]

Originally posted by Tyrone Slothrop
Robert Skidelsky, "Imbalance of Power," Foreign Policy (March, 2002).

Touche.

Since the article is not available for free online, an example, perhaps?

[Greedy,Greedy,Greedy]

Originally posted by Not Bob
Fair enough, though I agree with Sebby that it was a fair trade.

How about considering Lend-Lease as a counterexample then? If we really wanted to bleed John Bull dry, then why did we loan them the garden hose?

And there were people who wanted to bleed them dry, and continue the "cash and carry" policy until the crown jewels were hocked and moved to Chicago, but FDR wasn't one of them.

And our postwar conduct was even more selfless. Marshall Plan? (I know -- it was just to make the Commies look bad, and to preserve our market for Lucky Strikes and Coca Cola.)

Roosevelt not only had some broader and altruistic principals, he also felt strongly that once in the war we needed to win and that to win we needed to have the colonized people, particularly but not only in India and Egypt, with us, and not just reluctantly with us. Gandhiji had a following in the US from before the war, and he used it during the war to keep the pressure up for Independence.

There was a lot of strategy going on - Partition came to a great extent from the desire to have a strong Islamic counterwieght to communism (because it was feared that Congress and the Gandhiji were a bit of the fellow travelers). We made some huge blunders at Yalta, not least of which was backing the Shah. The strategy was motiviated by self-interest but also by some real principaled and anti-colonial feelings.

I am disappointed that Romney is fundamentally historically illiterate, but not surprised. Based on the last four years of watching the guy in Massachusetts, he's a wind-up toy.

I am disappointed and surprised that Ty is endorsing this neanderthal imperialist's view of the world.

[Tyrone Slothrop]

Originally posted by Not Bob
Fair enough, though I agree with Sebby that it was a fair trade.

I don't disagree.

How about considering Lend-Lease as a counterexample then? If we really wanted to bleed John Bull dry, then why did we loan them the garden hose?

I don't think Massie thinks we wanted to bleed John Bull dry, and I don't.

And our postwar conduct was even more selfless.

Some of it was.

[Tyrone Slothrop]

Originally posted by Not Bob
Touche.

Since the article is not available for free online, an example, perhaps?

I'm having a hard time finding free stuff on-line that isn't crap (hi Hank!), but I do recall the subject coming up in the context of books released in the last several years about Keynes, who was involved in negotiations between the UK and the US. Massie is, relatively speaking, something of a conservative, and I don't think he believes that the U.S. is evil, but I do think he's tired of the sort of ritual self-congratulation that many Americans, not least of them presidential candidates, often engage in.

[SlaveNoMore]

sebastian_dangerfield
Romney's speech was a new low in our race toward becoming the political laughingstock of the developed world. The only silver lining in the thing was knowing it was all such a huge, cynical lie. And that he won't be getting elected.

John Podhoretz:

"...Who is the audience for this speech, aside from people like me who make their living in part watching them and reading their texts and writing about them?

No one thought Romney would say that Mormon elders would play a leading role in his White House counseling him on policy. Anyone inclined to believe such a thing won’t be convinced by Romney’s protestations in any case."

[SlaveNoMore]

Tyrone Slothrop
... I do think he's tired of the sort of ritual self-congratulation that many Americans, not least of them presidential candidates, often engage in.

Right, because self-loathing is the preferred European ideology.

[Tyrone Slothrop]

Originally posted by SlaveNoMore
Right, because self-loathing is the preferred European ideology.

If you're not hyperventilating, you must be sticking your head in your ass?

[ltl/fb]

Originally posted by Not Bob
How about considering Lend-Lease as a counterexample then? If we really wanted to bleed John Bull dry, then why did we loan them the garden hose?

Dehydrated people have less blood?

[SlaveNoMore]

Tyrone Slothrop
If you're not hyperventilating, you must be sticking your head in your ass?

Is that yoga or pilates?

[Spanky]

Originally posted by SlaveNoMore
Good god.

This is such typical Elitist Euro claptrap, it almost borders on parody.

I thought it was parody.

[Spanky]

I just read Charlie Wilson's war a second time, and then it turns out it is coming out on the silver screen. I have always said that if they made it into a movie it would get panned because no one would believe it (even though it is all true - I think George Crile was honest). Fact is definitely stranger than fiction. If you have not read the book you should. It is amazing.

[sgtclub]

Or is this the worst slate of candidates we've ever had?

[Diane_Keaton]

Originally posted by sgtclub
Or is this the worst slate of candidates we've ever had?

As far as qualifications? Or electability? The Republican line up is awful. Do people really want a thrice-married bald man who wears a ton of orangey base makeup, is married to that Judy Nathan chick and was literally losing his mind until 9/11 made him refocus? Creepy guy (but on the plus side, he won't put up with Muslim shit). I just can't hear that accent all the time. Anyhow, could someone please explain again why McCain isn't the front runner? I just don't get that. Yeah he had melanoma but he's not like dying and isn't so old. His MOTHER is campaigning with him and she looks pretty good.

I'm bitching about the R candidates b/c I think we are going to end up with one of them as President. I really don't have faith that Americans will have the balls to vote for a black man for President. Things would be different if voters knew the man's name for a long time (like Colin Powell) but whereas I think Americans welcome a new white guy on the scene they won't do the same with a black guy who seems new to most. Clinton: too many negative feelings about her from the get go. From my standpoint, almost all of it unfair and she got the shaft as First Lady just for taking on something more than "helping paraplegics to read" as her cause. If we do get her as Pres, it would be pretty cool if she took badass stances with the UN's bullshit and *certain* other countries. I wish I could see more of that aspect of her.

[sebastian_dangerfield]

Originally posted by Diane_Keaton
As far as qualifications? Or electability? The Republican line up is awful. Do people really want a thrice-married bald man who wears a ton of orangey base makeup, is married to that Judy Nathan chick and was literally losing his mind until 9/11 made him refocus? Creepy guy (but on the plus side, he won't put up with Muslim shit). I just can't hear that accent all the time. Anyhow, could someone please explain again why McCain isn't the front runner? I just don't get that. Yeah he had melanoma but he's not like dying and isn't so old. His MOTHER is campaigning with him and she looks pretty good.

I'm bitching about the R candidates b/c I think we are going to end up with one of them as President. I really don't have faith that Americans will have the balls to vote for a black man for President. Things would be different if voters knew the man's name for a long time (like Colin Powell) but whereas I think Americans welcome a new white guy on the scene they won't do the same with a black guy who seems new to most. Clinton: too many negative feelings about her from the get go. From my standpoint, almost all of it unfair and she got the shaft as First Lady just for taking on something more than "helping paraplegics to read" as her cause. If we do get her as Pres, it would be pretty cool if she took badass stances with the UN's bullshit and *certain* other countries. I wish I could see more of that aspect of her.

McCain isn't leading because people are tired of seeing him run, which is sad in this election, since he is one of the best candidates in either party.

I read some pundit describing Rudy's campaign as "Yeh, I'm not likable, but you'll be safe." I don't know how far that gets you with GOP voters, since Huckabee is kicking everyone's playing the "I'm a swell, good, god fearing guy" card pretty effectively.

I like Barrack Obama because of the whole bunch of them he's the only human who has a chance of being elected. He's actually the person he is on the stump, which is amazing. I don't agree with a lot of his policies, but he is centrist if you read between the lines, more so than Hillary would be in office, I think.

In the end, I think Rudy wins a "lesser of two evils" squeaker against Hillary, and the collective brains of DailyKos, Focus on the Family, MoveOn and the Southern Baptist Convention explode everywhere.

All 500 of them.

[sgtclub]

Originally posted by sebastian_dangerfield
McCain isn't leading because people are tired of seeing him run, which is sad in this election, since he is one of the best candidates in either party.

I read some pundit describing Rudy's campaign as "Yeh, I'm not likable, but you'll be safe." I don't know how far that gets you with GOP voters, since Huckabee is kicking everyone's playing the "I'm a swell, good, god fearing guy" card pretty effectively.

I like Barrack Obama because of the whole bunch of them he's the only human who has a chance of being elected. He's actually the person he is on the stump, which is amazing. I don't agree with a lot of his policies, but he is centrist if you read between the lines, more so than Hillary would be in office, I think.

In the end, I think Rudy wins a "lesser of two evils" squeaker against Hillary, and the collective brains of DailyKos, Focus on the Family, MoveOn and the Southern Baptist Convention explode everywhere.

All 500 of them.

I have the same thoughts on Obama, although I need to read up more on his policies. I also think it would be a huge positive step if this country elected a black person, although I'm not sure he can beat Hilary in the primary.

I cannot bring myself to vote for Hilary for a multitude of reasons, but I do think she is a smart, formidable politician, who has successfully made her on mark apart from Bill.

Rudi is the only one on the GOP side I could vote for, but something about him is just not presidential. But his positions are mostly closely aligned with mine of all those in the race.

I think McCain is basically a well-intentioned idiot.

Huckabee strikes me as a charlatan.