Fashionistas you have arrived 3-25-03 - 10-3-03

[Penske_Account]

Originally posted by leagleaze
The kid didn't ask to be born, you know?

How do you know? What if before the kids are born they are like little puffs of spiritual smoke in some ethereal third dimension waiting to be born. And while they are waiting, at night, while we sleep, they sneak into our bedrooms (actually if they are spirits they don't have to sneak but whatever) and whisper in our ears "birth me, birth me now", "don't use a condom, go bareback", "don't pull out don't pull out", "pepperoni pizza" and other such subliminal exhortations????

Never thought of that, didja?

[ThurgreedMarshall]

Originally posted by Mister_Ruysbroeck
Thank you, thank you, thank you!!!! I am going to print out these articles and show them to people whenever they look at Mrs. R and me after we mention that we're thinking about not having kids.

You'd think it's a crime against humanity that we're thinking about not breeding. I don't care if we have "good genes" (their words, not mine) and that the world could use more "people like us." Fuck off. It's our life. We'll live it how we want.

I don't think you're going to find much opposition to your decision on this board.

TM

[spookyfish]

Originally posted by leagleaze
Some people just don't have the temperment to have kids. And if it weren't some default in society that you just have to have them, we'd all be a heck of a lot better off.

I'm convinced those people are called fathers. I love my kids very much, think they are generally pretty well behaved as kids go, but thank God that mrs. fish, is far more patient with them than I.

I'm not sure if this is nature or nurture. Any thoughts from others who have kids?

[soup sandwich]

Originally posted by bilmore
I know of no one else in my circle of parent-friends ("circle jerks"?) who regrets having had kids.

I also know of no one who wishes their kids weren't around. But, I do know of a few people who wish that they had decided to procreate with a different partner. I think, generally, that if someone has distaste for their kids, they also probably don't like their spouse much.

[NotFromHere]

However, I'm also a fan of guerilla etiquette reinforcement. Which means I advocate, upon being asked a rude, intrusive question, that people who are annoyed but not deeply damaged about the issue take it upon themselves to burst into hysterical tears and sob "Oh, God, I don't know! Why am I being punished like this? Why are you taunting me about it? How can you be so cruel?" and running off weeping while everyone in earshot glares at the rude interrogator for tormenting the innocent.

Man, I have always wanted to do that and thought about it a couple of times when confronted by the Catholic mother-in-law who keeps asking me if I'M SURE. Yes, I'm sure. I have been sure for many years. The continual badgering will NOT change my mind. On the other hand "it's none of your fucking business" doesn't get the right reaction no matter how badly I want to say it to people. Any other suggestions as to what to tell people (even co-workers) who ask when you're going to have kids?

[leagleaze]

Originally posted by robustpuppy
It's interesting that you say that. I have always wanted to be a mother, but have lately started to realize that I am not that crazy about kids. I do like babies, even when they cry, and when I see them or think about them, I have this very primal nurturing instinct and a strong craving to satisfy it. Ultimately, though, I fear my relationship with my child won't be as satisfying as I've imagined/fantasized.

I always joked that I got a puppy as a trial run for having a kid (and I never meant that to trivialize the experience of child-rearing). But now I'm starting to think that it's a substitute. Taking good care of her satisfies that nurturing instinct to a degree. In return, the dog is reliably cute, sweet, obedient, entertaining, and adoring. My poor kid wouldn't be able to compete!

r("Why can't you be more like your sister?" "Mom, she's a dog.")p

There is a woman here who refers to her pets are her kids to the degree that someone said to me wait, I didn't know so and so had kids. Now that is a little scary. I jokingly call my cats my kids from time to time, but everyone knows I am joking, and lord knows I hope if I do have kids I treat them with a little more consideration then shoving them off the couch and saying I told you to get the fuck away from me didn't I?

I enjoy kids, but I am not sure I have the patience to be a mother. I also have some concerns about making sure they have a good male role model, but that is a whole different issue.

[purse junkie]

Originally posted by Bad_Rich_Chic

I tend to greet the "when are you two having kids" question with the "goodness, I don't know, we haven't got a crystal ball" response, but if pressed when I've had a few I do admit occasionally actively getting into it with the pushy. Usually to the tune of "I was thinking about it until I met yours." One really shouldn't, under any circumstances, get into the substance of such questions, it only encourages them to pry more.

My tendency has been to offer a simple, unapologetic "I'm not." People then react one of two ways: (1) "you hate all kids, you monstrous unwomanly unnatural freak" or (2) "of course you will I didn't realize until I had them that my life was utterly empty and meaningless before".

This pisses me off then because (1) while I may or may not (and may certainly find your own kids unbearable), it doesn't lessen my essential decency as a person, and either way I'd never be rude enough to say so and (2) while your life may be a miserable useless pile of crap without kids, mine is actually pretty damn great. But there's no way to convince people without acting like I'm justifying my actions, which I won't do for some graceless idiot.

[SlaveNoMore]

greatwhitenorthchick
Is that the same movie as Desperado with Antonio Banderas and Salma Hayek? Or have I mis-named the movie? Or just otherwise confused?

Yes and no.

Rodriquez originally directed El Mariachi for about 10K on his credit cards.

It made such a splash that he re-made his own movie, the big budget Hayek [drool] vehicle "Desperado".

Some people call it a remake - others call it a sequel.

not7y(go Ducks)S

[leagleaze]

Originally posted by Penske_Account
How do you know? What if before the kids are born they are like little puffs of spiritual smoke in some ethereal third dimension waiting to be born. And while they are waiting, at night, while we sleep, they sneak into our bedrooms (actually if they are spirits they don't have to sneak but whatever) and whisper in our ears "birth me, birth me now", "don't use a condom, go bareback", "don't pull out don't pull out", "pepperoni pizza" and other such subliminal exhortations????

Never thought of that, didja?

Can't say I ever did.

I don't know why it wouldn't occur to me that someone would be a puff of spiritual smoke whispering in your ear, don't use a condom, don't pull out don't pull out.

I knew you were strange Penske. But I had no idea you were this strange.

[robustpuppy]

Originally posted by leagleaze
There is a woman here who refers to her pets are her kids to the degree that someone said to me wait, I didn't know so and so had kids.

I must go on record as saying that I never call my dog my kid -- although I did give her a name that would have been very nice for a little girl.

[evenodds]

Appropos of something, this is just foul:

It's a Boy! Will You Marry Me?

WASHINGTON (Reuters) - A woman who has a boy out of wedlock is much more likely to marry the father than if she has a girl, U.S. economists reported on Monday.
_
Full text: http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmp...rriage_boys_dc

[ThurgreedMarshall]

Originally posted by paigowprincess
I know there is a correlation between coming and splooiging for men, but I also know it is not direct (ie a guy can come without sploging and vice versa, though its not as common, though one guy I was with used to have multiples all the time with one splooge per- hey I am good). So 'splain

What? I have never come without ejaculating. I can't imagine how this would even be possible? Has this happened to anyone?

And as far as ejaculation without coming, I don't think it ever happens. I think there is some pre-ejaculate liquid that comes out, but I've never splooged without orgasming either. Although, I have seen American Pie (or whatever movie) where the nurse sticks her finger up Stiffler's ass and he splooges, but I think he came too. Slave? Can you field this one?

TM

[Gattigap]

Originally posted by bilmore
I know of no one else in my circle of parent-friends ("circle jerks"?) who regrets having had kids. I don't mean, who says they regret having kids, but who truly does regret having kids (and I'm only counting the ones whose inner feelings I think I have an accurate handle on.) So, I think the article is skewed. (I will admit that, like most on these boards, I hang around with people a bit off the poverty line, and, while money can't buy happiness, it can buy your kids bikes so that they leave you alone for a few minutes, giving you a better chance to go and look for happiness without being bothered by a request for yogurt or a ride or homework help or . . . and maybe poor people have more stress and actually DO regret having kids - but I just don't see it.

What he said.

As it happens, I have a newborn at the house, and have nighttime diaper duty. I will admit that on occasion I've questioned my decisions in this regard on a random Tuesday at 2:30am (since I'm up anyway), but only in the sense that I'm really freakin' tired and want some sleep. As Bilmore has pointed out, I might say it, but I don't really mean it. Often, I just want something to complain about.

Like 8-track, I (and the SO) occasionally remember fondly our carefree childless days, but not so much so that I would've done things differently.

(Of course, I'm speaking at the moment with experience at the newborn and toddler stage. My opinions may change ten years from now when the kid borrows and wrecks my car.)

Gattigap

[Bad_Rich_Chic]

Originally posted by Mister_Ruysbroeck
Are there any parents out there who will admit on this board that they wish they'd never done it?

The articles say there are many parents who will say things like "It's a lot of stress" or "It really strained my marriage" but won't take the next step and say "I wish I'd never done it." I guess they would feel bad suggesting they wished their offspring had never been born (which in their mind is probably the equivalent of wishing them dead).

Actually (and I can't find it on the net again, it was on some university website), I read a study of the "won't admit it" factor that suggest it is substantial - like the percentage of those who admit they regret having children increases five fold if reassured the poll is anonymous. And I would wager you could get very different answers to the questions "do you regret it" vs. "would you do it differently if you could do it again?" I think the study I'm thinking of was the same one done a couple of years ago that showed that satisfaction with parenthood was inversely proportional to the time spent with children (i.e.: divorced non-custodial fathers were the happiest with parenthood, non-working mothers the least satisfied).

The "70% said they'd not have children if they had it to do over again" stat is interesting but I doubt the Anne Landers column constitutes a properly controlled study.

[Not Bob]

Originally posted by Mister_Ruysbroeck
Are there any parents out there who will admit on this board that they wish they'd never done it?

The articles say there are many parents who will say things like "It's a lot of stress" or "It really strained my marriage" but won't take the next step and say "I wish I'd never done it." I guess they would feel bad suggesting they wished their offspring had never been born (which in their mind is probably the equivalent of wishing them dead).

Don't hold your breath waiting for such an admission either here or anywhere else. Who, even in this sorta anonymous forum, is going to admit that they wished their kids were never born? You hit the nail on the head with the whole "wishing them dead" analogy.

Also, the few parents who do feel this -- who actually think that having Junior was a mistake, ruined their marraige, kept them from pitching for the Mets, etc. -- know that an overwhelming wave of social disapproval will bury them if they even hint at such a feeling.