Politics: A new beginning

[Did you just call me Coltrane?]

Originally posted by bilmore
And I missed that you stuck these particular quotes in with a non-seq conclusory spin. We haven't found any. Powell appears to be admitting same. Kay says himself that it appears to him that Bush got bad info. But, "the party line"? Jesus, Sam, why not just keep repeating "Bush lied"?

Oh, yeah, because that spin went nowhere, as did the other thirty attempts, (damned museum stuff). At what point do you think you recapture credibility?

If you want something substantive to jump Bush on, go to his inability to hold spending down to less than half of what the Dems tried to put in their version of bills. Profligacy, Incorporated, man.

Bush's inability to hold spending down to less than half of what the Dems tried to put in their version of bills will kill us all. Soon.

[andViolins]

Originally posted by Did you just call me Coltrane?
Bush's inability to hold spending down to less than half of what the Dems tried to put in their version of bills will kill us all. Soon.

I thought MTBE was going to kill us all? Maybe not soon.

aV

[Hank Chinaski]

Originally posted by andViolins
MTBE

? the gas additive?

[Did you just call me Coltrane?]

Originally posted by andViolins
I thought MTBE was going to kill us all? Maybe not soon.

aV

I don't know what MTBE is, but I agree.

[Bad_Rich_Chic]

Originally posted by Did you just call me Coltrane?
I don't know what MTBE is, but I agree.

Common (?) gasoline additive.

[sgtclub]

Originally posted by Tyrone_Slothrop
Christie Todd Whitman and Paul O'Neill and Larry Lindsey don't have jobs in this Administration anymore, and it's because they didn't get with the program.

Point of fact, they left because they were incompetent.

[andViolins]

Originally posted by sgtclub
Point of fact, they left because they were incompetent.

I know that Whitman used to clash with others in the White House over her 'moderate' environmental policy, but I have never read that she was considered incompetent. Is there a basis for this statement Club?

aV

[bilmore]

Originally posted by Tyrone_Slothrop
In the interview I heard with Kay today, he said he didn't know what may have been shipped to Syria, but you guys are all spinning it as if he's saying there were WMD and that's where they went. You all doth protest too much.

He said: "We are not talking about a large stockpile of weapons. But we know from some of the interrogations of former Iraqi officials that a lot of material went to Syria before the war, including some components of Saddam's WMD programme. Precisely what went to Syria, and what has happened to it, is a major issue that needs to be resolved." That's pretty close.

If the President had been misled by the intel folks, and given bad info, don't you think he'd be mad? Don't you think he be getting all medieval on their asses? Christie Todd Whitman and Paul O'Neill and Larry Lindsey don't have jobs in this Administration anymore, and it's because they didn't get with the program.

Misled? How about, differing interpretations of what evidence was available? I doubt there's total consensus about much of anything between piles of analysts and techies. For myself, if a prez is getting contradictory conclusions from his people, with one group saying "this bad guy has WMD", and another group saying "not", I'd rather he erred on the side of caution. YMMV.

(I'm missing your point about getting with the program. We elect people based on the choices they wish to follow, and the philosophies they espouse. If an employee of a prez turns out to be unwilling to go along with the prez's views, are you implying that they should stay? Of course they get canned for not getting with the program. Clinton had a program. Reagan had a program. Carter had a . . . . well, ok, bad example.)

[Hank Chinaski]

Originally posted by bilmore
If an employee of a prez turns out to be unwilling to go along with the prez's views, are you implying that they should stay? Of course they get canned for not getting with the program. Clinton had a program.

in at least one case, Clinton had an assisted suicide program for wayward staffers.

[bilmore]

Originally posted by Hank Chinaski
in at least one case, Clinton had an assisted suicide program for wayward staffers.

You're referring to his help to Gore in the election, right?

(He invented Vince Foster.)

[Mmmm, Burger (C.J.)]

Originally posted by andViolins
I know that Whitman used to clash with others in the White House over her 'moderate' environmental policy,

I think that's how competence is measured in the white house these days.

[Secret_Agent_Man]

Originally posted by Not Me
First, why? The WMDs were just ONE reason to get rid of Saddam. Second, at the time the US invaded Iraq, everyone, even the fucking French, thought Saddam had WMD. Third, Saddam had WMD, he just shipped them to Syria.

OK. You win. There is no need for the intelligence agencies and/or the rest of the Administration to figure out what actually happened and why.

The force of your logic is overpowering.

S_A_M

[Secret_Agent_Man]

Originally posted by bilmore
Did you stumble past his comments in the last few days about how he is certain that WMD's were shipped to Syria pre-invasion, or did those comments not fit in well with your theme?

Saw nothing about that. I would like to know on what trustworthy intelligence he bases that belief -- if he actually holds it -- given his opinion of intelligence to date.

That is possible, I suppose -- particularly given that (as the No. 2 guy at CIA said in a recent WaPo interview) -- all of the WMD the Administration believed Iraq had could fit into one swimming pool -- so the biggest mistake may have been creating and/or not dispelling the perception that Iraq had mounds and mounds of WMD.

BTW -- What's my "theme?" And by that I mean MY theme -- not Ty's, not GGG's, not any other Democrat's , but MINE?

S_A_M

[bilmore]

Originally posted by Secret_Agent_Man
BTW -- What's my "theme?"

Can't do actual melodies in text, but the words go like this:

"There's a man who leads a life of danger.
To everyone he meets he stays a stranger
With every move he makes,
Another chance he takes.
Odds are he won't live to see tomorrow.

Secret Agent Man.
Secret Agent Man.
They've given you a number.
And taken away your name."

(Alternatively, your theme was that the "party line" on WMD's is a knowing falsehood, clearly contradictory to the truth as spoken by Kay. First, I'm not sure if there is a "party line", - Powell clearly is saying something different than Rummy, etc. Second, I think your use of that term clearly signals your belief that there is some concerted effort to push a falsehood, else you would probably have called it some more neutral term.)

[Tyrone Slothrop]

Originally posted by sgtclub
Point of fact, they left because they were incompetent.

With Larry Lindsey, you have a point. With O'Neill and Whitman, you are on crack if you believe that.