Nutjobs Ranting About Politics.

[Not Me]

How do you think her comment regarding what the "common man" think of her will play in Peoria?

[Tyrone Slothrop]

Originally posted by sgtclub
http://stuartbuck.blogspot.com/2004/...ry-photos.html

[blog detailing how Fox handled the doctored Kerry/Fonda pictures. Ty, your boy Drum got it WRONG]

(1) Point taken.

(2) Drum has the class to link to that, which tells you something.

(3) Drum wasn't attacking FOX, he was accusing all the right-wing critics of Rather of hypocrisy for failing to complain about the (evidently overblown) instances of people airing the fake Kerry photo.

(4) Why was the fake photo Kerry and Fonda being shown at all? Talk about having it both ways.

[sgtclub]

Originally posted by Tyrone Slothrop
(1) Point taken.

(2) Drum has the class to link to that, which tells you something.

(3) Drum wasn't attacking FOX, he was accusing all the right-wing critics of Rather of hypocrisy for failing to complain about the (evidently overblown) instances of people airing the fake Kerry photo.

(4) Why was the fake photo Kerry and Fonda being shown at all? Talk about having it both ways.

(2) that is classy

(4) fair point, but I think an attempt to set the record straight is what the press should do. The photos were out there and being discussed. How else do you set the record staight other than by reporting it? Or is your point that they could have made a statement without airing the pics?

[sgtclub]

Originally posted by Not Me

Speaking of Fox News, I heard about another gaffe by Teresa. She was attempting to comment on the performance of FEMA during the hurricances and I guess she felt they shouldn't have rushed in with supplies that included clothing. She said "let them go naked for a while, at least the kids."

That is completely out of context. Her point was that clean water and food were the first priority, which makes sense. She just has a political tin ear. This was not a Marie Antoinette moment.

[Say_hello_for_me]

Originally posted by Tyrone Slothrop
(3) Drum wasn't attacking FOX, he was accusing all the right-wing critics of Rather of hypocrisy for failing to complain about the (evidently overblown) instances of people airing the fake Kerry photo.

If I had seen them posed as a breathless expose' on 60 Minutes, I'd have been outraged when they were shown to be false. 60 Minutes would be pissing me off more by the minute if they dug in their heels and used terms like "unimpeachable source" or whatever. Who the hell is unimpeachable anyway, a dead person? I don't even think such a thing exists, but I'm beginning to believe that Swift Boat Veterans and Dan Rather are all Santa Clauses for good Republicans.

Originally posted by Tyrone Slothrop

(4) Why was the fake photo Kerry and Fonda being shown at all? Talk about having it both ways.

Why Spartan, why? How many fake photos have we seen of the Clintons and Kerry? Most of them were funny on their face. This appears to have been a slightly more subtle joke that took some time to get.

Hello

[sgtclub]

1996: In 1996, Kerry told the Advocate, a leading homosexual publication, the Constitution "unequivocally" requires states to recognize other states' same-sex marriage laws. "The misnamed and misguided Defense of Marriage Act [DOMA] is as unconstitutional and unnecessary as it is mean-spirited and malicious," Kerry said. "The authors of the bill mistakenly claim that Congress has the authority to allow one state to ignore a legally recognized marriage in another. But the U.S. Constitution is unequivocal on this point: 'Full Faith and Credit shall be given in each State to the public Acts, Records, and judicial Proceedings of every other State.' ...DOMA does violence to the spirit and letter of the Constitution by allowing the states to divide."

July 2004: "I'm against gay marriage," he said. "Everybody knows that."


August 2004: The Los Angeles Times noted "Kerry said in an interview published yesterday that he would have voted for the gay-marriage ban passed overwhelmingly this week by Missouri voters."


September 2004: "I did (say I would vote for the gay marriage ban in Missouri). And I was not aware (that it also banned civil unions). I was unbriefed and I thought it was the same amendment we had in Massachusetts. And that's very simple. I just thought it was a simple prohibition and not one that excluded civil unions. Obviously, it'd be inconsistent. I am for civil unions and, therefore, I would not have voted for that had I been there. ... I just didn't know it went as far as it did and, obviously, I don't support it."

Atticus, I'd ask you to take responsibility for the position of your candidate, if I could only figure out what his position is.

[Say_hello_for_me]

projections of changes in the senate and house? With the Presidential election finished, I am beginning to wonder how worried I should be about a filibuster-proof congress. Granted, I'd be way more worried about a filibuster-proof democratic congress, but this could cause a lot of problems over time.

Hello

[Tyrone Slothrop]

Originally posted by Say_hello_for_me
If I had seen them posed as a breathless expose' on 60 Minutes, I'd have been outraged when they were shown to be false. 60 Minutes would be pissing me off more by the minute if they dug in their heels and used terms like "unimpeachable source" or whatever. Who the hell is unimpeachable anyway, a dead person? I don't even think such a thing exists, but I'm beginning to believe that Swift Boat Veterans and Dan Rather are all Santa Clauses for good Republicans.

Rather seems to be pissed that the story has become the forged documents instead of the larger story he reported. He has been unsuccessful in reframing that debate.

Why Spartan, why? How many fake photos have we seen of the Clintons and Kerry? Most of them were funny on their face. This appears to have been a slightly more subtle joke that took some time to get.

I'm the non-metrosexual moderator here.

[Not Me]

Originally posted by sgtclub
That is completely out of context. Her point was that clean water and food were the first priority, which makes sense. She just has a political tin ear. This was not a Marie Antoinette moment.

Well she is wrong. They need clothing, too. You can't let people run around naked in this society, even children (except maybe very young children). Clothing is certainly as essential as water. And more so than food. You can go days without food. Most of us would be irreparably psychologically harmed if we had to stand around naked. Hell, when the US military did it to some Iraqis at Abu Gharaib, the fucking Dems on this board called it torture. Yet their proposed first lady sees nothing wrong with it. LOL!!

I think the real point is that Teresa has never experienced hardship in her life and it is easy for her to make flippant comments like that. That is precisely why it is a Marie Antoinette moment. She refers to the middle class as the "common man."

Do you know anyone in these areas of Florida that have been devastated? Do you know how many of them are frail elderly people who have no where to live and don't have the physical capacity to try to dig through rubble to find some clothing? Should they just go naked for awhile?

No, Club, you are wrong. This comment sprung from the mouth of a woman who has no idea what it is like to have hardship in her life. Some one needs to invite her to spend the night at Baltassoc's grandmother's section 8 apartment to give her some perspective.

[bilmore]

Originally posted by Hank Chinaski
okay. so hello has me on ignore. i know atticus has me on ignore. who else?

Not Me.

[bilmore]

Originally posted by Atticus Grinch
Don't flatter yourself. Just because I don't respond to your hourly PMs doesn't mean I'm ignoring you.

Do you guys really PM each other?

Now I'm hurt.

[bilmore]

Originally posted by Tyrone Slothrop
(2) Drum has the class to link to that, which tells you something.

I like Drum. I would beat him with a stick if I ever met him, but I would respect him as I beat him.

[bilmore]

You complain that I don't treat you "individually". That I treat all libs here as fungible. That I don't take your viewpoint seriously.

Maybe it's because you all use old, slanted info to make your partisan points. Maybe it's because you all (you, too) rip what's happening in Iraq, based on ignorance. Yes, effin' IGNORANCE.

Got any really close rels in Iraq?

How's this?

-------------

The US media is abuzz today with the news of an intelligence report that is very negative about the prospects for Iraq’s future. CNN’s website says, “[The] National Intelligence Estimate was sent to the White House in July with a classified warning predicting the best case for Iraq was ‘tenuous stability’ and the worst case was civil war.” That report, along with the car bombings and kidnappings in Baghdad in the past couple days are being portrayed in the media as more proof of absolute chaos and the intransigence of the insurgency.

From where I sit, at the Operational Headquarters in Baghdad, that just isn’t the case. Let’s lay out some background, first about the “National Intelligence Estimate.” The most glaring issue with its relevance is the fact that it was delivered to the White House in July. That means that the information that was used to derive the intelligence was gathered in the Spring – in the immediate aftermath of the April battle for Fallujah, and other events. The report doesn’t cover what has happened in July or August, let alone September.

The naysayers will point to the recent battles in Najaf and draw parallels between that and what happened in Fallujah in April. They aren’t even close. The bad guys did us a HUGE favor by gathering together in one place and trying to make a stand. It allowed us to focus on them and defeat them. Make no mistake, Al Sadr’s troops were thoroughly smashed. The estimated enemy killed in action is huge. Before the battles, the residents of the city were afraid to walk the streets. Al Sadr’s enforcers would seize people and bring them to his Islamic court where sentence was passed for religious or other violations. Long before the battles people were looking for their lost loved ones who had been taken to “court” and never seen again. Now Najafians can and do walk their streets in safety. Commerce has returned and the city is being rebuilt. Iraqi security forces and US troops are welcomed and smiled upon. That city was liberated again. It was not like Fallujah – the bad guys lost and are in hiding or dead.

You may not have even heard about the city of Samarra. Two weeks ago, that Sunni Triangle city was a “No-go” area for US troops. But guess what? The locals got sick of living in fear from the insurgents and foreign fighters that were there and let them know they weren’t welcome. They stopped hosting them in their houses and the mayor of the town brokered a deal with the US commander to return Iraqi government sovereignty to the city without a fight. The people saw what was on the horizon and decided they didn’t want their city looking like Fallujah in April or Najaf in August.

Boom, boom, just like that two major “hot spots” cool down in rapid succession. Does that mean that those towns are completely pacified? No. What it does mean is that we are learning how to do this the right way. The US commander in Samarra saw an opportunity and took it – probably the biggest victory of his military career and nary a shot was fired in anger. Things will still happen in those cities, and you can be sure that the bad guys really want to take them back. Those achievements, more than anything else in my opinion, account for the surge in violence in recent days – especially the violence directed at Iraqis by the insurgents. Both in Najaf and Samarra ordinary people stepped out and took sides with the Iraqi government against the insurgents, and the bad guys are hopping mad. They are trying to instill fear once again. The worst thing we could do now is pull back and let that scum back into people’s homes and lives.

So, you may hear analysts and prognosticators on CNN, ABC and the like in the next few days talking about how bleak the situation is here in Iraq, but from where I sit, it’s looking significantly better now than when I got here. The momentum is moving in our favor, and all Americans need to know that, so please, please, pass this on to those who care and will pass it on to others. It is very demoralizing for us here in uniform to read & hear such negativity in our press. It is fodder for our enemies to use against us and against the vast majority of Iraqis who want their new government to succeed. It causes the American public to start thinking about the acceptability of “cutting our losses” and pulling out, which would be devastating for Iraq for generations to come, and Muslim militants would claim a huge victory, causing us to have to continue to fight them elsewhere (remember, in war “Away” games are always preferable to “Home” games). Reports like that also cause Iraqis begin to fear that we will pull out before we finish the job, and thus less willing to openly support their interim government and US/Coalition activities. We are realizing significant progress here – not propaganda progress, but real strides are being made. It’s terrible to see our national morale, and support for what we’re doing here, jeopardized by sensationalized stories hyped by media giants whose #1 priority is advertising income followed closely by their political agenda; getting the story straight falls much further down on their priority scale, as Dan Rather and CBS News have so aptly demonstrated in the last week.

Posted by Captain Ed at September 17, 2004 01:36 PM

-----

But I bet a dollar you don't even make it this far. Read what someone on the ground has to say that knocks down your view? Heavens, no. But, slander the effort for the sake of a doomsdayer? Sure. He's in your party.

I never thought I'd say this, but it IS correct to attack the patriotism of the Dems. You'd rather we lost, just so your party wins. My god, how you guys must hate Bush. I can't imagine hating that much.

[Tyrone Slothrop]

Originally posted by bilmore
But I bet a dollar you don't even make it this far.

Do I get that deal too, or is it just for Wonk?

I never thought I'd say this, but it IS correct to attack the patriotism of the Dems. You'd rather we lost, just so your party wins. My god, how you guys must hate Bush. I can't imagine hating that much.

Fuck you, and the horse you rode in on. I don't hate Bush. I don't think I'd like him personally, and I think his policies are wrong for the country, but hate is a strong word and I don't think it applies. I'd rather Iraq looked like Connecticut and Bush was coasting with a 30-point lead in the polls, but I don't think it's just happenstance that we don't find ourselves in that situation. Fuck you for debasing what ties us together as Americans and exploiting it for narrow political purposes. Fuck you for thinking that you political party has some sort of monopoly on love of country. Fuck you for being so caught up in the political fight here that you can't even see that you are doing what you condemn.

[Say_hello_for_me]

in Sunday's edition

1972 typewriters?

>>On Monday, CBS turned to two new analysts to counter the critics. One of them, Richard Katz, said later that he had merely set out to prove the memos had not been created with Microsoft Word or other modern computer programs. He told The Post that he is not a document examiner and that "I have no interest in authenticating the documents."<<

>> The other analyst, Bill Glennon, said he is an information technology consultant, adding: "I'm not an expert, and I don't pretend to be." <<

A bit later:

>>While Glennon continues to insist that the documents could theoretically have been printed on a Vietnam War-era IBM Selectric, no one has been able to demonstrate this . Leading font developers say the technology simply did not exist 30 years ago. <<

And regarding the possible/likely source?

>>Since leaving the Guard, Burkett has run a ranch near Abilene, Tex., and been active in local Democratic politics, posting messages on the Internet urging other Democrats to wage "war" against Republican "dirty tricks." He has told reporters that he suffered from depression and had a nervous breakdown after the military declined to treat him for a tropical disease he contracted while on assignment in Panama. <<

Its a 4 page article. Numerous accounts of CBS making statements that are baseless. Numerous accounts from experts of all sorts. Representative expert:

>>One telltale sign in the CBS documents is the overlapping character combinations, such as "fr" or "fe," said Joseph M. Newcomer, an adjunct professor with Carnegie Mellon University. Blown-up portions of the CBS documents show that the top of the "f" overlaps the beginning of the next letter, a feat that was not possible even on the most sophisticated typewriters available in 1972. Newcomer calls the documents "a modern forgery." <<

and

>>Tests run by Thomas Phinney, fonts program manager for Adobe Systems, show that none of the possible font widths available on any typewriter or any IBM device from 1972 are able to produce an exact replica of the CBS documents. "Can they do something 'similar'? Sure," Phinney said. "Could they produce those exact memos? Impossible." <<

Unimpeachable my ass.

Read the full article here:

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn...04Sep18_3.html

I think its a good summary.

Hello