Fashion Board 11-2-03 - 12-09-03

[NotFromHere]

Originally posted by notcasesensitive
take a look at my moniker, then get back to me. I am not a capitalization Timmy. I am a spelling, usage and grammar Timmy. I assume that is explained in dtb's mysterious packet.

Ah yes, I see and I guess we are both banned from membership in the spacebar (or is that space-bar, space bar) club.

I guess that also excludes me from the hyphenation over-hyphenation club.

[Hank Chinaski]

Originally posted by leagleaze
Ok, you just made the English Major/Professor in me cringe.

of course. I'm threatening your fall-back job with my scathing observations.

Is that really your analysis? It can't be a Christ symbol because it is Christ? What do you think a symbol is?

something symbolic. not actual. Neo dies to save humanity. he is Christ.

It is meant to represent, or (get this) symbolize the thing in question, or in this case the general concept of one dying and being reborn to save others.

so in the last temptation of Christ, is Christ a Christ figure? Neo died to save us. its too much to be symbolic.

So Aslan dies and is reborn in Narnia (sorry for the lack of spoilers kids - I'm sure I've ruined it for you) and Neo "dies" and returns to save people. Heck people argue ET is a Christ figure, because he "dies" and comes back. Personally I think that is a bit much but that is neither here nor there. You know, Neo is really more of a Moses. He doesn't really die for our sins. He struggles to accept his abilities in order to free his people. Aslan does though, he is specifically willing to sacrifice himself to make up for the sins of one of the humans. And he is resurrected because of the purity of his act of self sacrifice.

And now you have made me a Christ timmy, and I think that sucks.

In lit classes there is some schmuck character who ends up sacrificing himself for others, or dies with his arms spread-eagle, or whatever. The profs point to this as a Christ figure, and thinking people say WTF? ET is a good example. Neo is suppose to be Jesus, just modern.

in West Side Story, is Anita Juliet, or a Juliet figure?

[Atticus Grinch]

Originally posted by leagleaze
You know, Neo is really more of a Moses. He doesn't really die for our sins. He struggles to accept his abilities in order to free his people. Aslan does though, he is specifically willing to sacrifice himself to make up for the sins of one of the humans. And he is resurrected because of the purity of his act of self sacrifice.

It isn't strictly necessary to invoke the Resurrection in the narrative to evoke Christ symbolism. If only the resurrected could be Christ figures, the symbolism would be limited to science fiction and other adolescent literature. See, e.g., "T2."

The best Christ imagery involves self-sacrifice woven so genuinely into the narrative that the character seems like em's acting like a person, not like a Christ. It's hard to congratulate blatant reference (see, e.g., "Billy Budd"). When done well, only after the fact, when looking at the story arc from 60,000 feet, do you see parallels to the Christ story. See, e.g., "Cool Hand Luke"; "Cuckoo's Nest."

[ltl/fb]

Originally posted by Atticus Grinch
It isn't strictly necessary to invoke the Resurrection in the narrative to evoke Christ symbolism. If only the resurrected could be Christ figures, the symbolism would be limited to science fiction and other adolescent literature. See, e.g., "T2."

The best Christ imagery involves self-sacrifice woven so genuinely into the narrative that the character seems like em's acting like a person, not like a Christ. It's hard to congratulate blatant reference (see, e.g., "Billy Budd"). When done well, only after the fact, when looking at the story arc from 60,000 feet, do you see parallels to the Christ story. See, e.g., "Cool Hand Luke"; "Cuckoo's Nest."

Christ is just one of many manifestations of the Syzygy archetype.

Christians, acting like they invented the whole concept of Christ figures, instead of just giving an existing archetype a name that is now widely used.

http://www.acs.appstate.edu/~davisct/nt/jung.html (discussion from someone at Appalachian State who appears to be quite familiar with the Jesus stuff)

http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg...79369?v=glance (a book that talks about Jung and Christianity)

http://www.mythologicalmovieclub.org...ws/matrix.html This is a discussion that bypasses Christ altogether (or should that be all together, NFH?) and just does Jung and the Matrix.

Edited to add various links.


Hi TF!

[Aloha Mr. Learned Hand]

Rapper 50 Cent was sued for $21 million today by a New York Post photographer who claims he was assaulted by the rapper's bodyguards.

http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmp...ople_50_cent_1

Reached for comment, the rapper said the suit was without merit:

"I don't know what you heard about me.
But a bitch can't get a dollar out of me."

[Hank Chinaski]

Originally posted by Atticus Grinch
The best Christ imagery involves self-sacrifice woven so genuinely into the narrative that the character seems like em's acting like a person, not like a Christ. It's hard to congratulate blatant reference (see, e.g., "Billy Budd"). When done well, only after the fact, when looking at the story arc from 60,000 feet, do you see parallels to the Christ story. See, e.g., "Cool Hand Luke"; "Cuckoo's Nest."

exactly. Cool Hand Luke, with Luke, arms spread out on the table, after passing out having eaten 50 eggs "for others." That's the symbol that lit profs could point to. I don't think its done as easily in the written word. The images in a movie can convey this sort of thing more subtlely.

Science fiction is creating alternate reality, so it can have alternate Christ.

[Fugee]

Originally posted by LessinSF
Bonus points...

Average Joe:

At first I thought that guy was joking around when he went into palpitations over a little peck. Lester omitted-- Bonus points for singing (not very well) some song about Vienna while in the desert and thinking the girl is blown away by it. Bonus points for having a group of guys with little dating experience give a back massage to the hot chick. Bonus points for guys who think admitting their lack of dating experience is a plus. Bonus points for the bitter fat dude who said he had a 1 in 8 chance of "getting some hot ass" being booted. Bonus points for guys who say there's a woman out there who "deserves" them (she must have piled up a lot of bad karma). Bonus points for a bunch of guys who wouldn't date a woman who was their equivalent in looks but whine about how they can't get a date. I'd love Kathy Griffin (who is otherwise annoying) to tell them they could date all they wanted if they didn't think they deserved to date supermodels. Bonus points for guys who are supposed to be personality rather than looks who have the personality of a toe rag. And bonus points for the most inscrutable line on a reality dating show (by the Indian aca-dork): "it's the simplicity of your complexity that's the catalyst of my infatuation."

Joe $$:

The show won't be the same without Olinda. Her cattiness made the show worth watching . They must be bringing back Linda to have one girl who might conceivably choose him after he tells the truth about the $$ because Cat and Anique won't. Petra is iffy but I doubt it. And Lester, I suspect the reason they didn't show more from his suite is that there wasn't anything to show. Otherwise they'd for sure have aired at least some audio.

[tmdiva]

Originally posted by Fugee
Average Joe

This show is great--so much that is unintentionally funny. I wonder if some of these guys will realize how dorky they look when they watch the show, or if they will still think they are cool.

I loved Dennis L. and am sorry to see him go, though he was far too asexual to have any chemistry with Milena. What a completely guileless individual. Something about him reminded me of Mr. Rogers.

I can't believe she booted the funny fat guy before booting Tareq the aca-dork (who is also too young for her, btw). I'm also really disappointed that she didn't just see through the shtick of that self-absorbed self-congratulatory TOOL Zach. I actually probably agree with him that he doesn't really belong on the show (other than personality, his main defect seems to be thinning hair), but he doesn't have to be so smug about it.

tm

PS Anyone have a good rec for a cheap DVD player? I don't feel like watching movies on the computer, and I don't want to make a big investment in a player while I'm waiting for the price to come down on the DVD recorders.

[SlaveNoMore]

ltl/fb
Christ is just one of many manifestations of the Syzygy archetype.

The sorceror sidekick of Vanth Dreadstar?

[AngryMulletMan]

I just read this report on an interview with the prosecutor in the Robert Blake case -- I guess it'll be on 48 Hours later:

Van Sant: "And are you convinced that [Blake] is the shooter? He is the man who pulled the trigger?"

Samuels: "I am convinced."

Van Sant: "What makes you believe that?"

Samuels: "The evidence. All of the evidence that we have in the case points to that conclusion."

Van Sant:"There are no fingerprints?"

Samuels: "True."

Van Sant: "There is no DNA."

Samuels: "True."

Van Sant: "There's no forensic test that definitely says the gun residue from that particular nine-millimeter round is found on Robert Blake?"

Samuels: "True."

Van Sant:"There are no eyewitnesses."

Samuels: "Absolutely true."

Van Sant: "You add all that up and you don't have a case, do you?"

Samuels:"Yes, you absolutely have a case....you can still have a very compelling case without any of those things."
http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2003/...in583058.shtml

Um, where's the case? Seriously, I don't get it.

[str8outavannuys]

Originally posted by NotFromHere
Yes. Of course. What was I thinking? Cheap Trick is the ultimate source of spelling, grammar and all that is right.

As the proud owner of several CT picks, caught while in the crowd at various Indian casinos throughout the Southland, let me just say that my favorite Christ figure is:

[str8outavannuys]

Originally posted by Fugee

Joe $$:

The show won't be the same without Olinda. Her cattiness made the show worth watching . They must be bringing back Linda to have one girl who might conceivably choose him after he tells the truth about the $$ because Cat and Anique won't. Petra is iffy but I doubt it. And Lester, I suspect the reason they didn't show more from his suite is that there wasn't anything to show. Otherwise they'd for sure have aired at least some audio.

THANK YOU for bringing up Joe $$. Can we please get a round of applause for Cat, who is doing exactly what women are supposed to do on these stupid shows, that being, use her considerable pulchritude and sex appeal to manipulate this guy into liking her. When she got up in the middle of the night to knock on Joe's door (presumably for some late-nite luvin), I stood up from my comfy chair and applauded. Here's to you Cat. Fuck and win, baby, fuck and win.

str8

[leagleaze]

Originally posted by Hank Chinaski
of course. I'm threatening your fall-back job with my scathing observations.

Yes, I'm terribly scathed. But more, I think you just don't understand what people mean when they say someone is a Christ figure. Hence the whole admission I was being a timmy.

Sometimes people find Christ figures where they don't exist, like my ET example. Though the character shares some of the ideas I think it is a stretch to call him a Christ figure. English profs definitely push some shit so they have something to talk about.

A Christ figure though is just meant to be a retelling, retooling or representation of Christ. That's exactly what Neo is. A retooling and representation. In the last temptation of Christ, Christ is Christ. It is the "history" of his life, with some poetic license.

It is the same with any figure. If someone does a movie about JFK, the character who is meant to be JFK is JFK. On the other hand, if someone does a movie about a JFK like person, that is not meant to be JFK, but it might well be representative of him.

You mean Maria yes? This is a different issue. Maria is derivative of Juliet, she is not Juliet. Juliet is not a dancing, singing, Puerto Rican. The thread of the story is Romeo and Juliet and Maria represents the Juliet character. She's meant to be a version of her, a retelling of her. Is Neo a retelling of Christ? Sure, why not. And of Moses and of Alice in Wonderland too. But that doesn't make him Christ. He's a fictional character, so by definition, he cannot be Christ. He can only represent him.


Edited to add:

Yeah the whole concept that any time someone sacrifices himself for the greater good he has to be a Christ figure is a bit tiresome. People were sacrificing themselves long before Christ, and the reason profs find Christ figures where the authors didn't intend them is that they read it from a Christian perspective. It's rather irritating actually.

[ThrashersFan]

Originally posted by ltl/fb
Just for you, Thrasher, I am posting this:

Perhaps she is British. Don't they treat collective nouns as plural? The team are going for ice cream?

I may be mistaken. I'm sure someone on here will know.

Ah, those crazy-ass (hyphen, not hymen) Brits. The team never goes for ice cream. But they wear their hockey sweaters, no matter where they go (Hi Gwinky!).

I was listening to hockey tonight (Hi Gwinky!) and someone said "pond hockey" and I got all, you know, "sensitive" where it was nice.

Carry on.

[ThrashersFan]

Originally posted by Aloha Mr. Learned Hand
Rapper 50 Cent was sued for $21 million today by a New York Post photographer who claims he was assaulted by the rapper's bodyguards.

http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmp...ople_50_cent_1

Reached for comment, the rapper said the suit was without merit:

"I don't know what you heard about me.
But a bitch can't get a dollar out of me."

So sorry to see that "the man" is after "fitty." Shady Records. Shot in the mouth and still can't get a break. Cuz he's a mother-fucking P*I*M*P