Politics As Usual

[spookyfish]

Originally posted by Tyrone Slothrop
Take Slate's blue-state/red-state quiz.

In a surprise only to those who think they know me from this board, I'm in the middle, but tending a little red.

I'm also in the middle tending toward red, but I live in flyover land. What's your excuse?

[sgtclub]

Originally posted by SlaveNoMore
A relevant question posted on the same site:

"So why is he making speeches? He should be screaming this from the rooftops, and hammering in every media door in the country. Am I missing something? No offense -- I love the blogs -- but this has to be broken out."

Agreed. If true this is horrible. I am skeptical with claims made by Hersh though.

[sgtclub]

http://apnews.myway.com/article/20040715/D83R8SBO0.html

[passengers give up first class seats for soldiers]

[sgtclub]

Tony Blair yesterday:

No one lied. No one made up the intelligence. No one inserted things into the dossier against the advice of the intelligence services. Everyone genuinely tried to do their best in good faith for the country in circumstances of acute difficulty. That issue of good faith should now be at an end ... But I have to accept, as the months have passed, it seems increasingly clear that at the time of invasion, Saddam did not have stockpiles of chemical or biological weapons ready to deploy ... I have searched my conscience, not in the spirit of obstinacy, but in genuine reconsideration in the light of what we now know, in answer to that question. And my answer would be that the evidence of Saddam's WMD was indeed less certain, less well-founded than was stated at the time. But I cannot go from there to the opposite extreme. On any basis he retained complete strategic intent on WMD and significant capability. The only reason he ever let the inspectors back into Iraq was that he had 180,000 US and British troops on his doorstep ... Had we backed down in respect of Saddam, we would never have taken the stand we needed to take on WMD, never have got progress on Libya ... and we would have left Saddam in charge of Iraq, with every malign intent and capability still in place and every dictator with the same intent everywhere immeasurably emboldened. For any mistakes made, as the report finds, in good faith, I of course take full responsibility. But I cannot honestly say I believe getting rid of Saddam was a mistake at all.

[Secret_Agent_Man]

Originally posted by sgtclub
She inhales?

After her Dad's experience with Ms. M, I'd bet she's learned to swallow.

S_A_M

[sgtclub]

LONDON: Saddam Hussein had links with terrorists like Carlos the Jackal and Abu Nidal and groups connected to Al Qaeda, Iraqi Prime Minister Iyad Allawi said on Wednesday.

“The record of Saddam shows very well his connections to international terrorists, like Carlos and Abu Nidal,” Allawi told BBC radio. “We know for sure that he had established links with chieftains in Sudan, to work closely with Al Qaeda and Al Qaeda style organisations,” he said.

Allawi also defended the US-led coalition’s move to go to war against Saddam, describing it as “a moral decision taken on ethical grounds.” Speaking on the day an inquiry is due to report on the use of Britain’s intelligence to justify the invasion, Allawi thanked British Prime Minister Tony Blair and US President George W Bush.

“The Iraqi people, we are deeply appreciative of both the role of Tony Blair and President Bush in helping Iraq to liberate itself,” he said.

http://www.dailytimes.com.pk/default...5-7-2004_pg4_3

[the Spartan]

Originally posted by Secret_Agent_Man
After her Dad's experience with Ms. M, I'd bet she's learned to swallow.

S_A_M

Forget Ms. M, like mother like daughter.....although I'd imagine mon's lovers would rather that she had a long tongue. FWIW NTTAWWT.

[Gattigap]

Originally posted by Replaced_Texan
They didn't disguise his voice, and he was apparently outed by the Boston Phoenix. He asked NPR to just call him "Mike."

Related story in Salon.com

ETA: interview with the author in Salon.com

Slate has run a story providing the Cliffs Notes to the book. Interesting take, including this:

Page 182: The United States tapped Mongolian troops for occupation duty in Iraq, despite the historical enmity between the nations. The infamous Mongol general Hulagu Khan, grandson of Genghis Khan, sacked Baghdad in 1258, slaughtered hundreds of thousands of Muslims, and remains one of Iraq's most despised villains.

Niiiiiice. Good to know that we're using our historians in the DOD to maximum effect.

I suppose the upside for us, though, is that the Mongols are unlikely to leave if some of their personnel are kidnapped and beheaded. So at least there's that.

Gattigap

[Secret_Agent_Man]

Originally posted by sgtclub
Agreed. If true this is horrible. I am skeptical with claims made by Hersh though.

Actually, there was a reference to something like this in one of the early news reports when the scandal first broke. IIRC, the statement was that there was a videotape (taken by Americans?) showing a 15 -year old prisoner being sodomized by other Iraqis. The rapist was the fellow whom, you may recall, was then punished with humiliating photos in which "Rapest" was scrawled upon his skin.

This largely got lost in all of the hullabaloo over the other incidents -- perhaps because no photos/streaming media was released. As my colleague said "Tip of the f-ing iceberg. If it all comes out, we're screwed." So Congress and the Admin decided not to release anymore.

S_A_M

[Hank Chinaski]

Originally posted by Gattigap
Niiiiiice. Good to know that we're using our historians in the DOD to maximum effect.

Shit. If the Iraquis hold grudges for 750 some years, that alone should have give us pause on the whole operation.

[SlaveNoMore]

Secret_Agent_Man
Actually, there was a reference to something like this in one of the early news reports when the scandal first broke. IIRC, the statement was that there was a videotape (taken by Americans?) showing a 15 -year old prisoner being sodomized by other Iraqis. The rapist was the fellow whom, you may recall, was then punished with humiliating photos in which "Rapest" was scrawled upon his skin.

This is quite different from what Hersh is apparently claiming i.e. the Americans did it.

This largely got lost in all of the hullabaloo over the other incidents -- perhaps because no photos/streaming media was released. As my colleague said "Tip of the f-ing iceberg. If it all comes out, we're screwed." So Congress and the Admin decided not to release anymore.

Why isn't the same sector of the public that screams for the public release of this [purportedly disgusting] material also not lambasting the media for their self-censorship of (1) the 9/11 WTC footage, (2) the Fallujah burnings and (3) the numerous beheading videos?

[Gattigap]

Originally posted by Hank Chinaski
Shit. If the Iraquis hold grudges for 750 some years, that alone should have give us pause on the whole operation.

Well, OK. Remember, though, that Saddam was comparing himself to the 12th Century Saladin even before the war started, so I'm not sure that this argument works to your benefit.

[Shape Shifter]

Originally posted by SlaveNoMore
Why isn't the same sector of the public that screams for the public release of this [purportedly disgusting] material also not lambasting the media for their self-censorship of (1) the 9/11 WTC footage,

What does Iraq have to do with 9/11?

[Tyrone Slothrop]

Originally posted by SlaveNoMore
Why isn't the same sector of the public that screams for the public release of this [purportedly disgusting] material also not lambasting the media for their self-censorship of (1) the 9/11 WTC footage, (2) the Fallujah burnings and (3) the numerous beheading videos?

These are two different things. I want whatever happened to be a matter of record, because I think it otherwise will be whitewashed and not dealt with adequately. Sunlight the best disinfectant, and all that. I do not, however, want to see any of it -- torture, WTC, Fallujah, beheadings, Game 7 of the ALCS -- unless I go looking for it.

[bill killer]

Surprisingly, i'm just a little blue; apparently, knowing how to shoot a gun goes a long way toward cancelling out my otherwise indigo tendencies.

Originally posted by spookyfish
I'm also in the middle tending toward red, but I live in flyover land. What's your excuse?